PastorVineyard

It appears that the young master Keontre Reese didn’t read the papers. If he had, he might have seen Pastor Tom Vinyard’s open letter criticizing the local police chief for advocating stricter gun laws. Maybe Reese couldn’t read at all. You’d think seeing a sign on a house stating, “Nothing on this property is worth your life” would encourage him to select another target. It seems foolish to break into the house of a “vocal supporter of gun rights” and then attack him in his own home . . .

From newsok.com:

A pastor at a northwest Oklahoma City church who has been a vocal proponent of gun rights has been cleared of wrongdoing in the fatal shooting of a 14-year-old boy at the pastor’s home. …

The pastor arrived home about 3 p.m. and as he checked his house, he was attacked by the burglar, who had been hiding in a closet in a back bedroom, Prater said.

As the Pastor’s published letter detailed, during a mission to Africa, his family’s home was invaded and his skull fractured by his attackers. He and his family cooperated with the robbers, but it wasn’t good enough. Highly restrictive gun laws in the country where they were working prevented them from being armed.

I suspect that experience did much to shape and reinforce Pastor Vinyard’s Second Amendment Advocacy. It’s sad that his fourteen year old attacker didn’t pay attention in Sunday school — if he went at all — and did not heed the warnings on Pastor Vinyard’s house.

©2014 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice is included.
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80 Responses to Defensive Gun Use of the Day: Victim Selection Failure Edition

  1. Oh no, another victim of ‘gun violence’
    That’s how shannon and her ilk will tell it.

    Whereas I see it as a positive community development.
    How many more burglaries would the Yoot have committed, how many thefts, assaults, etc., are now NOT going to happen.

    • “Oh no, another victim of ‘gun violence’. That’s how shannon and her ilk will tell it.”

      It is worse than that … this attacker will fall into the child category of victims of firearms.

    • And another point that should clearly NOT go unnoticed:

      “…during a mission to Africa, his family’s home was invaded and his skull fractured by his attackers. He and his family cooperated with the robbers, but it wasn’t good enough.”

      Comply, cooperate, beg all you want with a vicious invader, but you never know how it’s gonna turn out, and odds are very heavily in favor of there not being good outcome and chances are very good that you and your loved ones will be harmed or killed.

      Shannon and her crowd should suck up those words of wisdom, but they are too blinded by their rhetoric and dogma to recognize reality.

      Like keeping a battery of fire extinguishers strategically placed in case of a fire that may never occur, keeping oneself armed and having self defense tools including firearms on hand in case of a physical attack only makes “common sense”.

      • Maybe she looked around the room as she was filling out his birth certificate and all she could see was a tray with a key on it.
        “Hmm… key…on a tray. keyonatray. Keontre!”

        That’s how my brother Shuonflor got his name.

      • Remembered reading our local leftist newspaper rag writing a glowing PC story about a high school with 600+ females with no duplicate names. All crazy ass wacked out names. Oh well…. I’m saving money to help have my grand children home schooled.

    • The parents will show up arm in arm with Al Sharpton seeking a settlement for their pain and suffering from whomever they can blame for failing their child who has deep pockets.

  2. Maybe he’s been reading the MDA site and was convinced that the robber can always take the owner’s gun away and turn it against him or her. Probably figured he could get a gun to sell along with the other loot. Easy peasy, according to Shannon…

      • Or in short, come to think of it, that only the police are able to effectively handle firearms in any kind of stressful situation…

    • Well, this is stretch, but perhaps those signs led the yoot to think there were especially-valuable goods in the house, possibly even GUNZ! and thus distorted his thinking.

      Glad to see this pastor wasn’t one of those “Turn the other cheek” types. Perhaps because he did that once and it didn’t end well.

  3. Yep, he’d have been much better off and much safer without that gun in his house. And, what the hell kind of name is Kenotre Reese? Who the hell’s named Reese?

  4. Another reason to carry all the time, everywhere you can, including at home.

    Obviously something was amiss from the moment he came home, because the story said he “checked his house.” We need to keep our eyes open to details whenever we get home to make sure we are similarly aware if someone has broken in.

    • In this case, I’d guess the decedent’s break in technique was less James Bond and more James Bong (crowbar on the door jamb, broken window, etc.).

      Some more sophisticated criminals do hide their entries quite well, so it can be difficult to detect them.

    • The actual article states he was Christmas shopping and was notified by his alarm company that a motion sensor was tripped. He drove home to check it out, which is what I do when a motion sensor is tripped rather than have the alarm company notify police, I always assume it’s the cat or somebody left a window cracked and the wind blew something over. In this case the kid had yanked an air conditioner out and crawled in through the hole. The kid attacked him and in the struggle he was able to draw his handgun and fire. Kid had a robbery charge pending against him in juvenile court in an unrelated case. Obviously still in his criminal apprenticeship. Sad still.

  5. If you have a soul, this should trouble you. Horribly sad that a 14 year old boy put himself in a position where a man was forced to take his life. Horrible that his parent(s) will have to live with their failure to teach respect, honesty, right and wrong, for the rest of their lives. My heart especially goes out to this pastor, a man of God, no doubt a man that would do anything within reason to avoid bringing harm to another, now has to live with this the rest of his days. I know God will not hold this against him, I pray that he finds peace in the days ahead.

    • “Even a child is known by his doings…”. I have a soul and a redeemed spirit by the blood of Jesus. Pretty sure the age of accountability(if you believe in that concept) is 5 or 6 in most humans. Proverbs20:11 BTW. Do adult crime-get adult time ( or a bullet). Sorry if that’s harsh.

      • Ah, there we are. I was thinking of that quote and I would’ve paraphrased it badly.
        It’s a little shocking on the surface, but sadly, little punks are nothing new. The only thing that’s changed is that they’re afforded more opportunity to grow into big punks these days.

        • @Don–It is not about being cold, callous, and even ruthless, oh wait those feelings are exactly what help in a life or death contest of good men encountering evil men. If you hesitate your gun gets taken away from you or a bullet enters you, not cold just reality or don’t carry a gun. If still alive thank God and if you need ask for forgiveness, which is not required for dispatching corrupt men. The pastor knows that the bible says it is a moral man’s duty to protect innocent life even by killing, and there is no way that a good man being attacked by a feral savage can be called murder, unless the shooter was a White Cop.
          Why should a man have to feel bad for doing the right thing, and if he does have trouble compartmentalizing he just needs to remember 1 bullet ending an evil predator saved many future lives.

    • To which deity are you referring – and praying to? It had better be “Sixgun God” Jerry Miculek because we don’t believe in unsubstantiated fairy tales here (see comments to Dec 25 TTAG post “Housekeeping: Retraction”).

      Please contain comments to TTAG-related subject matter and the fairytales to wherever the other fairies do their thing.

      • Poor baby. I hope you’re not offended when you stand before the ONE whose earthly incarnation the vast majority of America just celebrated. Have a special eternity…

      • Mark Lee,

        We are all free to accept or reject the concept of an all powerful, knowing, loving, and holy Creator … and we are all free to speak about our position on it. That concept affects the lives of believers in a pervasive, powerful, and positive way and is quite relevant in a discussion of a pastor who righteously used deadly force to defend himself. (Hint: unbelievers may have no thoughts or remorse whatsoever for killing another human regardless of the legality … whereas believers treasure life and will recognize and grapple with the tragedy of the situation.)

        As for your snide comments about “unsubstantiated fairy tales”, please rebut the evidence and assertions of believers. Show us which evidence is bogus and clarify where their assertions are incorrect.

      • Mr. Lee,

        Atheism, humanism, and theism all require faith. I happen to be a Christian who believes in Intelligent Design. If you are so arrogant as to label my faith a “fairy tale,” that is your problem and not mine.

        As to the comments, we start off mostly gun related and go from there. Some of the tangents are quite interesting. Nobody is forcing you to read them.

        • “Atheism, humanism, and theism all require faith.”

          Right, the same way that non-golfers require golf clubs.

      • So Mark Lee, is there more than one of you? Or is it more along the lines of a royal we? Just to let you know,”we”, as in Americans, don’t have royalty and “we” aren’t subjects.

        As for this web site, this site is about the history, politics, morals, ethics, business and just plain fun of guns; (paraphrasing the mission statement if this site).

        So along the way; talking about Americans Christian heritage in discussing gun use is perfectly acceptable.

        If you Choose to believe in no G-d, that is your choice; but telling someone they can’t reference G-d in discussing morals and values of defensive gun use is extremely intolerant, hateful and bigoted.

    • “I know God will not hold this against him, I pray that he finds peace in the days ahead.”

      Hey, Don?

      There’s this God ‘Top-10-List’ Commandment that translates out to…

      “Thou Shall Not Steal”

      It’s not a suggestion.

      “…I pray that he finds peace in the days ahead”

      The community will, thank goodness.

    • “Horrible that his parent(s) will have to live with their failure to teach respect, honesty, right and wrong, for the rest of their lives.”

      I’m with you Don, but the biggest part of the problem here is the parent(s) don’t have a clue that their own failure is what led to this. They’ll just be bitter and blame the white man’s evil injustice.

  6. Keontre huh? This is why I don’t go to a lot of neighborhoods in Chicago anymore. Saw a story on the local news about very young 14 or 15 year old armed robbers in the city. Young ,dumb and full of…well you know. Big +1 Pastor!

  7. “He and his family cooperated with the robbers, but it wasn’t good enough. Highly restrictive
    gun laws in the country where they were working prevented them from being armed.”

    Life is a hard teacher but to his credit Pastor Tom had the good scene to LEARN…. He
    might also want to check his copy of the good book to.

    When a strong man armed keeps his palace, his goods are in peace Luke 11:21

  8. I live and work in this neighborhood. The black youths know right from wrong. Unfortunately most of their parents do not. Incarcerated for drug possessions and the children being raised by single family grandparents living of the government dime. Very sad. Same town where little speedy was shot robbing a pharmacy and another lil’ so and so was busting caps at a now closed shopping center. County sheriff double tapped him from the second level about 75 yards away. +1 for the good guys. I carry regardless of the sign that say not too. And I home carry. I will be damned if anyone takes mylife liberty or property. Anyone.

    • Interesting Link. Thanks, Ryan. I’ll refrain from passing judgement on Keontre Reese, but I think the article you linked probably speaks well enough to the issue.

  9. “NewsChannel 4 spoke with Rev. Vineyard in 2013 after his church was put on a hate list following controversial comments he made about homosexuality.
    “Because I’m a pastor, I have to take a stand for what is morally right,” he told us in 2013.”

    The other rainbow coalition is known to be militant at times so I’m thinking the security system, signs and gun may be a response to that controversy.
    Maybe Keys-on-a-Tray was upset the pastor didn’t approve of his lifestyle?

      • If eighties movies are accurate most gangs are made up of overtly gay men judging by the fashion of their clothes. I just can’t imagine straight thugs dressing in cutoff denim jackets tight leather pants and mesh belly shirts.

  10. “… the young master Keontre Reese didn’t read the papers.”

    I s’pect that alot o’ folks ’round here don’t read the papers, either, what with their disdain fer “liberal media” an’ all.

    Does Fox even read letters on the air?

  11. Such a terrible loss. Ammunition is expensive y’know. Rev. Vinyard (any relation to Derek Vineyard from American History X?) will have to replace that round sooner or later. It’s so sad.

    • Well if he didn’t shoot ‘im with one of them new fangled personal defense rounds and hit ‘im lead slugs he coulda just picked it out wit’ a pocket knife and recast it.

      Only out .02 cents of powder. Prob’ly find that lyin’ in the couch.

  12. I am pretty sure that despite his previous experience, Pastor Vineyard would have preferred not to have been forced to shoot Keontre Reese to death.

    I am also pretty sure that condemning this 14 year old kid for his “bad choices” and suggesting he “got what he deserved” glosses over the more compelling question of where was the point of failure in his life and what can we do to put a stop to young Black males choosing the Pop Culture Lawless Tough Guy lifestyle as a valid role model to aspire to.

    We see the same story, over and over again, with just different names and faces, so, obviously, there are forces and influences of evil running rampant in our Society preying upon unprepared kids, and we need to identify them and figure-out how to stop them.

  13. Anybody named one of those low class nonsense names such as “Keontre” is highly likely to end up in jail or dead early, unless they are a spectacular athlete. Sorry if that is offensive (not really), but facts are facts.

  14. Why do people always blame the parents for the kids being criminals? We all are responsible for our individual choices and not molded machines that all of a sudden break bad. Guidance from our parents or peers is only a small amount of the input that is needed to establish a moral code as the individual can accept or reject the data, and the rest is contained in how the individual perceives their surroundings.
    Here is this moral dilemma: Why do we as a society view strong arm robbery as being so bad when the crimes of bankers and politicians effects ten times more victims?
    Some folks know that blood money by the pen is worse than blood money by the sword, but the difference is one criminal is called a respectable citizen and the other an outlaw.

    • Parents have the single biggest non-geneticimpact on children during their formative years, especially the first 6 months of life but all the way through adolescence. Parents make up the genetic input into a child’s character. Crap parents make future criminals, or at least future problems.

  15. I disagree with onlry on statement in the article: “It’s sad that his fourteen year old attacker didn’t pay attention in Sunday school — if he went at all — and did not heed the warnings on Pastor Vinyard’s house.”

    I do not find it sad. It is likely he did not reproduce–which all things considered is a good thing.

    On a second point:

    There is a line from Shakespeare: “A rose by any other name…,” and one should take care as that sentiment expressed really only applies to roses–not to people….he was handicapped when he was named in a handicapped and violent subculture.

    His parents clearly eschewed the dominant successful culture (which unfortunately is increasingly being rejected by the general population and explains our coming collapse) in the name they chose for their miscreant offspring. Had their values been different and thus had they give him a name like Richard, Robert, Mike, William, Donald, Jack, John, Mark, David…something more aligned with the culture in which they are embedded–and had they not rejected that culture–it’s quite possible he would be alive. People marched for desegregation and then some choose to segregate themselves! Senseless!

    v/r

    SamAdams1776 III Oath keeper
    Molon Labe
    No Fort Sumters
    Qui tacet consentit
    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
    Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges.
    Idque apud imperitos humanitas vocabatur, cum pars servitutis esset.

    • Try being a teacher in these neighborhoods. The first day of school is spent learning how to pronounce their names. This young man went to my school last year. I never had him in class but had to deal with him often. He had no respect for the law or others’ rights. He acted like the world owed him something. Other students were victims of his outrageous behavior as he constantly interrupted the education of everyone else.

        • We do our very best, but we can only work with what parents send us. When education is not valued in the home, our hands are tied. We can’t force them to take advantage of the opportunities that an education will present them. This case is a perfect example of that.

        • yep. trying to hold teachers solely accountable for the academic outcome of students ignores the single biggest variable in the process: the student.

          I can tell you exactly how to fix the public school system, but most people won’t like it:
          1 – have a tiered educational system similar to Germany’s, in which the highest tier is prepared for university. One of the tiers should be a first-rate trades training program. This requires society to give up on the myth that every mouth-breathing illiterate should go to college.
          2 – don’t require kids to go to school. if they don’t want to be there, they destroy it for everybody else.
          3 – Students should have to earn their slot in school, just like future thugs have to earn their way on to the school basketball team. if students refuse to get with the program, fire them.
          4 – put some academic rigor into the education of teachers. Sorry, but education degree programs are among the easiest in
          college.

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