It Should Have Been a Defensive Gun Use: London Beheading Edition

Edmonton crime scene (courtesy breitbart.com)

“A woman was beheaded in at a house in north London this afternoon, with witnesses reporting that a man then went ‘on the loose with a machete,'” breitbart.com reports. “Police say the suspect, a 25 year old male is now in custody at a local hospital receiving treatment for wounds sustained during the course of his arrest. He will be assessed by psychiatrists, tested for drugs and questioned by Homicide and Major Crimes officers. . . . DCI John Sandlin, who is leading the investigation, earlier said . . .

This was a highly visible attack in broad daylight on a residential street. I can understand why this may cause people concern, however we are confident that we are not looking for anyone else at this stage… Local officers and specialist detectives are at the scene and will remain there for many hours to come.

We could have filed this story under This Is What Happens to a Disarmed Populace. But the point is the same: whether they’re facing a crazed killer or a determined terrorist or some combination thereof, a disarmed people are defenseless against barbaric attack.

Even in a police state, there aren’t enough police to protect the populace. And if the police are the problem . . . there is no solution, save armed self-defense. [h/t Henry Bowman]

comments

  1. avatar Daniel Silverman says:

    Interesting they didn’t release the suspects name… HHHMMMMM…..

    1. avatar Renegade Dave says:

      http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1324194/Mohammed-popular-baby-boys-ahead-Jack-Harry.html

      The #1 name in Britain right now is Muhammad of various flavors, if I were a betting man…

      1. avatar DBM says:

        Can they test for islam now? Why didn’t they give a description of him? These beheadings will probably become more common and the brits deserve it for being so damned politically correct.

        1. avatar vix says:

          Brits like an 82 year old woman DESERVE to die? More US citizens are killed by guns than Brits with knives so why do you deserve it? Maybe because you’re obsessed with ‘defence’ you don’t see the ease with which you attack each other?

        2. avatar Old Ben turning in grave says:

          @Vix

          Approximately 80% of the killings in the US are committed by criminals, on criminals. Outside of the bad parts of inner cities, most Americans can go years, often their whole lives, without first-hand experience of serious violence. And our problem has the same root cause as those in the UK: people voting against the best interests of their country.

        3. avatar Jim says:

          A Kansas City homicide detective I know backs you on that statement Ben. According to him the vast majority of the killings were thug on thug.

        4. avatar Dempsterdumpster says:

          @Vix. I doubt DBM meant that literally. Having said that, I always wonder at how citizens of various countries wag their fingers at each other over matters of purely domestic policy and law. As an American, I say to any Briton who cares to listen that if you want to live a disarmed life, go for it! If you want to enforce that disarmed life on one another within your borders, have at it!

          The lesson I take away from this story is that disarmament has it’s down side. There are many stories of armed elderly men and women in the U.S. prevailing over much stronger assailants. Those anecdotes and others of successful armed defense, inform and motivate my choices. I prefer to be armed, taking full advantage of my right to be so as preparation for the possibility of being assaulted, AND I am willing to live with the fact that others around me will be doing the same.

          If you are British and revel in your culture of disarmament, seriously, good for you. If you respect our contrasting preferences, then we can all be friends.

        5. avatar Jus Bill says:

          But remember that you begged America for guns in two World Wars because you had disarmed yourself prior to each one.

        6. avatar vix says:

          @dempsterdumpster … you wish for mutual respect between our two countries yet you instantly defended abhorrent commentary from your countryman and assumed he ‘did not mean it literally’

          It’s fair that we each have our own policies yet you did not aim your comments again at someone from the USA who LITERALLY stated the UK ‘deserve it’

          That’s interesting, very interesting

      2. avatar vix says:

        statistics for male names in 2013.

        1. Oliver
        2. Jack
        3. Harry
        4. Jacob
        5. Charlie
        6. Thomas
        7. Oscar
        8. William
        9. James
        10. George

    2. avatar Mack Bolan says:

      Indeed. But I’d be willing to put a brick of rimfire up that he was of a certain religious affiliation.

      Machetes and Islam…like peanut butter and jelly. But not terrorist related….more a hate crime.

      1. avatar Dickie J says:

        With our current border and immigration policies and our political correctness, this will be coming soon to a town near you. And me.

        1. avatar Stinkeye says:

          In most of the towns near me, if someone starts getting froggy with a machete (regardless of their religious persuasion), they’re going to have several spontaneous fluid leaks in short order.

          You don’t bring a knife, even a very large one, to a gunfight.

        2. avatar ChiGurh says:

          Every time i hear that ol’ saying, I think of the scene from The Punisher movie:
          http://youtu.be/CsqClktIKZQ

          I now like to say ‘Don’t bring any underestimation to a gunfight.’

      2. avatar SteveInCO says:

        A brick of rimfire?

        Sorry, that exceeds the house limit for wagering.

    3. avatar Grumpy F'er says:

      A 25 year old with a machete going after and 82 year old unarmed woman? That takes guts. What a man. I’m mean, she could have bled all over him or something.

      The lady was just living her life. The only one she had or will get. Meanwhile:

      “Police say the suspect, a 25 year old male is now in custody at a local hospital receiving treatment for wounds sustained during the course of his arrest.”

      He gets to live, and have everything paid for by the public.

      I would not want to be the family member who has to ID the body. RIP.

      1. avatar The Brotherhood of Steel says:

        Indeed. What a barbaric country.

        1. avatar Soccerchainsaw says:

          Well at least it wasn’t GUN VIOLENCE because we all knooooow that GUN VIOLENCE is sooooo much worse than other kinds of violence…..

        2. avatar Barstow Cowboy says:

          Maybe the U.S. should form a coalition and go invade it.

      2. avatar RockThisTown says:

        How it reads: “Police say the suspect, a 25 year old male is now in custody at a local hospital receiving treatment for wounds sustained during the course of his arrest.”

        How it should read: “Police say the suspect, a 25 year old male, has assumed room temperature.

      3. avatar uncommon_sense says:

        “He gets to live, and have everything paid for by the public.”

        Of course … it is a simple way for government to create one more person dependent on government. And that requires more bureaucrats … more people dependent on government. Is the cycle becoming clear yet?

        1. avatar Swarf says:

          Careful. You’re going to split your yoga pants with all that stretching.

        2. avatar uncommon_sense says:

          Swarf,

          No stretching at all. Bureaucrats are government employees. The only difference between bureaucrats and welfare types is that most bureaucrats have to punch a time clock to get their government check.

          The significance? Those bureaucrats are another huge voting bloc that will continue to vote for job security — and job security is a huge, bloated, intrusive, micromanaging government.

        3. avatar JR_in_NC says:

          Fun fact: According to the State’s own economic report, Government is the fastest growing “industry” in NC.

          uncommon is making a lot of sense. Refuse to see what is going on or don’t – that does not change facts.

      4. avatar Jus Bill says:

        I’ll wager he accidentally falls down a few flights of stairs. A few times. So tragic…

    4. avatar Jonathan - Houston says:

      Exactly. First thing that jumped out to me, too, was the lack of name or picture of the killer.

      Just like in our local liberal rag, the Houston Chronicle, reporting on smash-and-grabs, police chases, murders at illegal, after-hours bars or underground game rooms routinely excludes those details. But that’s fine: you’ll know them by their absence.

    5. avatar Dave357 says:

      The suspect’s name is Nicholas Salvador.

      http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-29089893

    6. avatar rlc2 says:

      “Fat Nick” is converted Muslim.

      Update- h/t Gateway Pundit:

      http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/page/2/

  2. avatar ColdNorth says:

    It’s not all bad news, the British Police are now instructing people to investigate crimes themselves.

    No, really-

    “Victims of crime are being “encouraged” to investigate offences themselves, an inspection of police forces in England and Wales has found.”

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-29053978

    It won’t be long before they are told to protect themselves. Or rather, before they decide to start following the Farmer’s old saying. Shotguns are still quite easily obtained in the UK.

    1. avatar Sian says:

      That frees up the British police to crack down on more important crimes, like speaking poorly of certain religions and disagreeing with the government.

  3. avatar James says:

    Been a lot of talk of beheadings lately… Wonder if they’re connected in any way…..

  4. avatar Jeremy S says:

    Who parks like that? Sheesh. Even my 2-year-old stays inside the lines better.

    1. avatar Gunr says:

      For a moment, I thought it was my wife!

    2. avatar Stinkeye says:

      Relax, Jeremy, it’s just a bad parking job. Nothing to lose your head about.

      Too soon?

    3. avatar A samurai says:

      A guy named “Jeremy” is criticizing parking in Britain… Clarkson? Is that you?

  5. avatar the ruester says:

    Innocent people get beheaded over there all the time. Has there ever been something like that here? In broad daylight, while people stood by helplessly, filming it with their iphones ? How can these people feel so smug about this island prison that they are all trapped in?

    1. avatar ThomasR says:

      They have a law in England that you can,t carry anything with the intent to use it for self-defense.

      Admit on Facebook you carry an umbrella for self-defense; then end up using it for self-defense; you can be charged with a felony.

      1. avatar Gene says:

        Thank goodness you have to be 18 to buy a butter knife. UBC in GB for the silverware!

        1. avatar ThomasR says:

          They have a version of the Boy Scouts in England. When they’re out camping, if they need a knife to cut some cordage; they have to borrow one from the Boy scout leader, and immediately return it after they’re done.

          No. I’m serious, you really can’t make this stuff up.

        2. avatar JR_in_NC says:

          What’s sad about that, Thomas – or I should say one more thing that’s sad about that – is that they had Scouts before we did. Our scouting program was modeled on theirs.

          That’s okay, though. Think about how far WE have sunk in THIS country. A mere 150 years or so ago, a 12 year old boy could be junior officer on a warship…a young man with actual leadership responsibilities on a freaking war ship.

          Now, we have 22 year olds called “children,” and not just by MDA. It’s common vernacular and socially, we’ve come to believe that folks are not responsible adults until AFTER COLLEGE.

        3. avatar A samurai says:

          @ JR
          So, if people aren’t responsible adults until “after college” does that mean that people who never go (or graduate) should never be held responsible for anything they do? Because they are just kids?
          That explains so much of the rhetoric in the media in this country. Scary.

    2. avatar vix says:

      We’ve had TWO beheadings? Compare that with US school shootings. .. In broad daylight… With people filing it on their iphones helplessly… that ‘supreme gentleman’ USA had recently? He used a hammer, car and guns…. how can you feel ‘smug’ about being able to own guns when your killers are so weird too?

      1. avatar Peaches says:

        Quite easily, because we can defend ourselves.

        1. avatar vix says:

          You clearly cannot which is why you have MORE murders in the USA than we do per capita in the UK

        2. avatar A samurai says:

          @ Vix
          “You clearly cannot which is why you have MORE murders in the USA than we do per capita in the UK”

          Once again this statement is a logical absurdity. There are 250 Million more people in America than the UK, of course there will be more murders. But even further here is something great about America you don’t seem to be aware of. NOT EVERYONE HAS A GUN AT ALL TIMES.
          See in America we have limited government and enumerated rights, NOT requirements. People in America can CHOOSE if they wish to own a gun for whatever reason they want. They aren’t restricted from by their government like in the UK, OR they are NOT required to it. Yes murders still happen. But at least we get to choose for ourselves we don’t have to beg our nanny government for the tools of self defense.
          I’d rather life Free, and die young by chance, then be kept locked in a “safe” box to waste away until I am old.

        3. avatar Sian says:

          @vix
          We had more murders per capita here in the US 60 years ago when our gun laws and the UKs were pretty much the same, so your blame game doesn’t really pan out. Of course you lot weren’t even considered citizens back then. Our country is more violent due to many socioeconomic reasons, some of them shameful for sure, but at least we aren’t looking at making people outfit their kitchens with stab-proof knives.

      2. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        Your angst should not be directed at those seeking to defend themselves. That is repugnantly immoral.

        Your anger should be directed at those that perpetrate heinous acts…in either country.

        You need to separate the two. “Gun ownership” does not equal violent or criminal. Take that first step, and a whole lot of enlightenment will follow.

        1. avatar SteveInCO says:

          +1

      3. avatar A samurai says:

        Vix,
        Go home you limey Red Coat. Here is the great thing that happened in 1776, We became our own country so you all can make choices for your country and We can make choices for ourselves here without your judgement.
        Now, on the topic of murders. You have this great selective memory. The UK has had its fair share of school shootings as well as the new round of beheadings. Further, comparing the murder rate in America and The UK just on numbers is ludicrous. The total population of America is estimated at 313 MILLION. The total population of The UK is 63 million. Of course there are more murders in America, we have 250 MILLION more people in our country then you do in the UK. Stop trying to pass some kind of judgement on America because you think YOU have all the correct answers. If you hate American gun laws so much go back to your blissful prison and get off an American Gun Laws and New post board.

        1. avatar scoutino says:

          In low voice: “Pssst, you know what PER CAPITA means, right?
          On different note, criminality here in US keeps falling year after year as more and more guns is sold.

        2. avatar vix says:

          … In the room, we have found the level

          Now as this is a story about LONDON I suggest you GO HOME you trailer park sister shagging gap toothed hill Billy yank

          Offensive enough a retort?

          Now just in case this is still a debate despite your low IQ attempts to derail, any comments are welcome in reply to my points but I’m not a gun popping knee jerk hysteric who wants to racially aggravate the whole world…

          Your guns are small, jets are not.. Each time you congratulate yourself on your aggressive streak you should recall that and apologise to all the victims of who died on 11th of the 9th because violence and arming yourself only lead to more violence and people arming themselves with something bigger. .. The final solution? A big wild west shoot out? Why don’t you try and evolve and become more intelligent about weapons?

      4. avatar the ruester says:

        *cough* “GUN FREE ZONES” *cough”
        *cough* “WE DON’T SUPPORT THEM” *cough*

        1. avatar the ruester says:

          That was weird, there was something in my throat. See there are these places in America where smug british style Americans actually TRY (I know, it’s ridiculous) to enforce a british style utopia; we call them “gun free zones.” Those are where most of our mass shootings occur, obviously because criminals know that british, and not American, gun rules are in effect there. Anyway, that’s all I was trying to say, thanks for your patience!

  6. avatar T Rogers says:

    Meanwhile Obama will beheading back to the golf course.

    1. avatar Kenneth says:

      You win the internet today!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    2. avatar Gunr says:

      Great post!
      How long did you have to wait till you found a place to slip that in?

  7. avatar Frank Masotti says:

    And this is what happens to a disarmed population.

  8. avatar RandallOfLegend says:

    Honor killings by a peaceful religion

  9. avatar Gunr says:

    Get ’em all a bunch of Airsoft pistoles, paint ’em orange with a black tip so the muggers will think there real.

  10. avatar Anonymous says:

    If both parties had a gun they would have been on equal footing. Since neither had a gun – the advantage leans toward the larger stronger attacker – in the case – the man with the machete. Sad they are forced to be victims.

    1. avatar vix says:

      She was an 82 year old woman doing her garden. .. why would she have a loaded gun on her? You know even if you own a gun someone can still catch you by surprise and use a machete on you? That it’s still possible? You don’t have a built in gun do you robocop?

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        You are REALLY trying to make good points, aren’t you.

        Yes, you can still be surprised if you carry a gun. But the odds of being able to fight back are quite a bit higher.

        Can you find one single case where a US woman with a gun was successfully raped, for example? Or, would you care for us to point your to the many cases in this country where elderly people successfully defended themselves against younger, bigger, more intrinsically violent attackers?

        For my part, here is some interesting reading (see Comment #3 for stats and sources)

        http://www.thomhartmann.com/forum/2014/04/guns-do-not-protect-rape-victims

        So, what immoral justification can you offer to allow weaker people to remain at the mercy of stronger people that wish to do them evil, without even the chance of fighting back?

        1. avatar vix says:

          So women do not get raped in the USA? Your guns have not reduced your crime rates at all because violence is so prevalent in the USA, even in your defence arguments

          Iceland has more gun ownership yet less crime overall… why do you think that is?

        2. avatar Sian says:

          @vix
          our crime rate and murder rate have steadily declined over the past 30 years, and gun sales are stronger than ever.

          Iceland has low crime because it has : largely racially homogeneous population and a great deal of economic parity throughout its population.

          If you look, discounting several blocks in certain large cities with concentrated poverty and poor social services, that the vast majority of the US has violent crime and murder rates directly and favorably comparable with any disarmed European first world country.

        3. avatar JR_in_NC says:

          “So women do not get raped in the USA? “

          Now you are just being daft.

          I said provide a link to a story of an ARMED woman being successfully raped.

          In point of fact, women successfully defend themselves against rapists, robbers and home invaders with regularity in this country. Do a quick Google search for some recent cases in Detroit, for example.

          What moral justification do you have for only violent thugs and psychopaths to have guns, or other weapons (including their size and willingness to do violence) while seeking to disarm the innocent?

          Your attitude on this matter is completely and utterly disgusting. That you try to hide behind illogical nonsense to try to justify your immorality is laughable.

        4. avatar Jus Bill says:

          See, Vix, the difference between us and you is that you’re not moderated out of existence and banned here.

  11. avatar The Brotherhood of Steel says:

    The BBC has a video depicting a British general explaining how royally screwed western Europe is in the face of a real military threat. Europe has slashed and destroyed their militaries to the point where they are meaningless. NATO is meaningless without US support. He explained that all the western European nations combined would struggle to produce ONE division in good time to defend against an attack. Europe’s fate lies either under the boot of the New Hammer and Sickle or under the sword of the Star and Crescent.

    1. avatar uncommon_sense says:

      Meh, Western Europe will quietly issue stern words and impose economic sanctions in the face of an onslaught.

    2. avatar Michael says:

      I agree with you comment about Western Europe, but do you think the Russians could be organized to move a division into Western Europe?

      1. avatar Jus Bill says:

        They have two combat ready divisions sitting on the Ukraine border right now. As in ready to deploy.

  12. avatar Chuck says:

    MDAKMSUK – Moms Demand Action for Knife and Machete Sense in UK

    Nicknamed the SUCKS.

    The UK needs more machete-free zones! DO IT FOR THE CHILDREN AND ELDER !

    1. avatar vix says:

      Joke post right?

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        No. Sarcastic maybe, but sadly no joke.

        It is not one bit funny that there are people in this world that thing paper signs stop those with violent intent….and as such, many are duped into believing their safety is thus guaranteed.

        1. avatar Chuck says:

          What Jr said.

          Because everyone here knows those intent on doing evil will be stopped cold on its tracks by a “no guns!” sign . . .

  13. avatar mirgc says:

    Clearly the solution is to ignore the be-header alone and ban knives! That’s my gun-sense!

  14. avatar Raul Ybarra says:

    What’s interesting is that in the U.K. you have to have justification to own a knife, as well. Wonder what this guys reason was?

    1. avatar Gunr says:

      Maybe he doesn’t own it anymore than most thugs in the US own the guns they commit crimes with.

      1. avatar Barstow Cowboy says:

        That sentence structure was a crime.

        1. avatar Gunr says:

          I try.

    2. avatar Sian says:

      Well clearly he was taking it gardening.

  15. avatar Custodian says:

    It may sound harsh, and I don’t care, because I too, once, hailed from a country, a British crown colony, that has such draconian laws for self defense and firearms, as well as any weapon. The thing is, anyone who is living under such a system, and does nothing to fight it, well, you deserve all the negative consequences, that it brings your way, too.

    1. avatar roadrunner says:

      NJ?

    2. avatar vix says:

      So you deserve to be the victim of a school shooting? Or mown down by a car driven by a supreme gentleman? Or to be beheaded on a coach like Tim McClean?

      Illusions and smoke and mirrors. .. you gobble up greedily the perceptions of safety owning a gun gives you

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        What illusion are you talking about? OWNING a gun does not make anyone safer, but the willingness to use one certainly does. Or more importantly, the willingness to fight back, and the recognition that guns are among the best tools for that job.

        You are apparently one of those people that ignores facts. Read up on Kleck, Lott and a few others. These things have been studied.

        1. avatar vix says:

          If it made you safer then why does the USA have such a high crime rate especially for violent crime?

          Just so you understand NRA = National Rifle Association… spread out from your NATION = INTERNATIONAL, therefore International Rifle Association = IRA

          I’m no troll – that is the typical losing remark of someone who doesn’t understand. .. I’m sorry but that was simple, I shouldn’t have had to explain that at all

        2. avatar JR_in_NC says:

          “If it made you safer then why does the USA have such a high crime rate especially for violent crime?”

          What a stupid statement. We are safer armed than unarmed.

          Every single study that has been in the US has shown something from ‘no correlation’ to ‘negative correlation’ between crime rate and gun ownership. Every. Single. One.

          That means that at worst gun ownership rate does not effect overall crime rate, but may indeed correlate with DECREASED CRIME.

          But, we are not talking about crime RATES over an entire population. We are talking about INDIVIDUAL safety. A weapon to fight back from an attack makes ME safer. Or my wife. Or any other INDIVIDUAL.

          You keep harping on the US having such a high crime rate. So, what is the US rank of crime in the world? Are we #1? No. Are we #10? No.

          What ranking are we? By your “logic,” we should be #1 or thereabouts. The FACT is, we are not even CLOSE to that. Like every other attempt to misinform in this thread, your point is a complete and total FAILURE at stating simple, verifiable fact.

        3. avatar Jus Bill says:

          JR, you’re trying to patiently explain thermonuclear technology to a member of a stone age society. There are no words small enough to instill understanding.

        4. avatar Steve Day says:

          @ Vix
          “vix says:
          September 5, 2014 at 08:59
          If it made you safer then why does the USA have such a high crime rate especially for violent crime?”

          Wrong again troll. You are 3.5x more likely to be a victim of violent crime in the UK than you are in the US!

          I looked up the stats myself. Sources World Health Organization, US Department Of Justice, UK Office of National Statistics.

          If you believe the UK is a charm filled gun-free zone that “never has mass killings”, how do you explain Derek Bird of Cumbria who in 2010 shot 23 people and killed 12 (plus himself – making that 13 dead on the Mom’s Demand Action / Bloomberg scale) ?

          I grew up in the UK and moved to Texas in 2000. I feel safer here than I ever did over there.

    3. avatar vix says:

      So 911 and the Boston marathon bombing we’ve heard about didn’t actually occur? They couldn’t have because owning guns solves everything therefore attacks ONLY happen in country’s that control guns…

      Phew that’s lucky … those are just fairy stories when I hear of attacks in America because you have ALL the answers

      1. avatar uncommon_sense says:

        Vix,

        No one is claiming that firearms prevent all attacks. No one is claiming that firearms guarantee an armed victim will always prevail.

        The fact is that firearms enable an armed victim to inflict serious damage against a stronger, faster, and/or armed attacker or even multiple attackers. That capability stops many attacks before they even happen and stops many more in progress. And that is why only 8% of burglaries are “hot burglaries” (home invasions while the occupants are home) in the United States. Burglars know that many/most home owners are armed and will shoot them … so burglars in the United States go to great lengths to make sure a home is not occupied before breaking in to steal something.

        In the U.K, where burglars have no worries about armed homeowners, about 50% of burglaries are “hot burglaries” (home invasions while the occupants are home). Burglars know that none of their victims are armed and pose no threat to them so burglars boldly rob homes while the occupants are inside.

        1. avatar vix says:

          That stat is wrong, it’s not 50% and with the massively high rate of violent crime still happening in the USA I only find it more disturbing that those figures are LOWER than they might be if there were no guns

          Why is it that other countries with high gun ownership have lower crime rates?

        2. avatar JR_in_NC says:

          “That stat is wrong,”

          Prove it. Provide source data.

          “I only find it more disturbing that those figures are LOWER than they might be if there were no guns”

          More fantasy. How can you possibly make this claim with a straight face.

          So, there was no crime and violence before the invention of firearms? Utter rubbish.

          And guns exist. You are not going to uninvent them. What you are talking about doing is trying to give them only to certain groups of people.

  16. avatar SouthernPatriot says:

    No guns in Britain for law abiding citizens to defend themselves against attacks by criminals, the mentally unsound, or jihadists. Some here would want that fate for us. Resist it, oppose it, fight against it, for our sakes and our grandchildrens’ sakes!

    1. avatar vix says:

      Again! Tim McClean

      1. avatar Sian says:

        McClean was in Canada. A country where the people have no carry rights.

  17. avatar Bernard says:

    What happened to the MDA article after this one?

    1. avatar OCD says:

      You aren’t the first to ask that. Their message was deleted.

  18. avatar former water walker says:

    I wouldn’t be surprised if this is connected to ISIS/ISIL/IS. Allah must be proud of this vermin. I also wonder if this scum is part of the Lee Pace soldier murder. My sympathy to the family.

  19. avatar esitue says:

    Soon the UK will be a Collective Utopia, there are only a few million pommies left to murder

  20. avatar Don says:

    How is it that London’s pervasive surveillance didn’t stop this tragedy?

    1. avatar Paul53 says:

      Film at 11?

    2. avatar Steve Day says:

      Because the people-control wizards over there fail to grasp the concept that “security cameras” are really just “evidence gathering cameras”.

    3. avatar vix says:

      Have you every taken an IQ test? You may not be human

      1. avatar J. Zoss says:

        You unjustifiably complain about someone calling you a troll for not having the same views. Yet you ask if someone has taken an IQ test and question if they are human because you didn’t like him pointing out his perceived failures of your disarmed societies solution of replacing guns with magic cameras.

        I agree with Don that you are a troll, just less informed than the average one. You are obviously in favor of the physically strong having an overwhelming advantage over the weak in violent encounters. The current situation in your minuscule never-going-to-be-Utopian island provides a crystal clear example of this flawed thinking process.

        Why are you so worried about guns anyway? Don’t you have a march against knife carrying to attend to? Did you manage to get the scary pointy tips removed from all kitchen knives yet? (not a joke for anyone that doesn’t know) You know so nobody could possibly cut anyone with them? When you get rid of all of the knives are you guys going to start pulling everyone’s nails and teeth next? Probably should start pushing to have brain functions removed as well. Then you could all shuffle around blissfully know there was no possible way anyone could get hurt there anymore. Utopia at last!

        1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

          For the record, I didn’t call Vix a troll for taking a different view. I called Vix a troll for repeatedly misstating facts and making unsupported / unsupportable claims in the process of making emotional arguments. Use of factually incorrect “talking points” is not serious discussion.

          I called Vix a troll for being an anti-gun troll, not for being anti-gun.

  21. avatar Paul53 says:

    Assessed, tested and questioned? I’d say this ones defective and should be recycled. Retroactive abortion?

  22. avatar Alpo says:

    This is just swell:

    “The man was arrested after armed police, who had distracted him to avoid other attacks, cornered him in a house and Tasered him, during which some officers were injured.”

    So the armed police- because some are unarmed- used tasers on a machete wielding lunatic murderer. And some were injured in the process.

    For f**ks sake, just shoot the effin bastard

    1. avatar esitue says:

      Not to beat a dead horse but it is obvious that the UK is ruled by a host r-Type Socialists who care not a whit about the lives of the innocents under their despotic rule, in fact hey prefer to have their serfs a constant stat of panic, the better to herd them about at will!

      1. avatar uncommon_sense says:

        “… in fact [t]hey [U.K.] prefer to have their serfs a constant stat of panic …”

        Yes, that means more people more dependent on government.

      2. avatar vix says:

        The real panic is in the nonsensical posts on here thinking a gun saves the USA when you have more sinister and disgusting attacks there than the UK… children murdering their parents and each other for Slender Man…. eating each other in the streets like naked zombies… beheading each other on buses.. no guns are saving you at all

        1. avatar uncommon_sense says:

          Vix,

          Guess what? Essentially all of the victims of “sinister and disgusting attacks” are unarmed, whether the victim was in the U.S. or the U.K. So, yes, guns do prevent armed good people from being the object of a “sinister and disgusting attack”.

          If guns do NOT prevent “sinister and disgusting attacks”, then it should be easy for you to cite three examples along the lines of an attacker beheading an armed good person, or an attacker beating an armed good person to a pulp, or …

  23. avatar Paul53 says:

    A good man with a machete never stopped a bad man with a machete?

    1. avatar Steve Day says:

      Anyone using self-defense in the UK is punished more severely than the attacker!

      1. avatar vix says:

        Not true

        Evidence of one case?

        1. avatar uncommon_sense says:

          One example: Tony Martin

      2. avatar vix says:

        I don’t know why I cannot directly reply to uncommon sense but in the case of Tony Martin, he is now out of prison and the kid he shot is dead so hardly evidence of the victim (Tony) being worse off than the robber (now stone cold dead) is not accurate is it?

        1. avatar uncommon_sense says:

          Vix,

          Tony Martin received a much longer prison sentence than the home invader (and accomplices) who survived and were prosecuted. So, yes, the victim received a longer prison sentence for defending themselves than the attackers.

  24. avatar Bruce Badger says:

    Another “Baptist Gone Bad”.

    1. avatar Gunr says:

      Are you sure? I heard they found a Watchtower pamphlet in his pocket??

    2. avatar ThomasR says:

      Maybe it was an Amish gone bad.

  25. avatar Eric L says:

    Two thoughts pop up in my head
    1) THIS is the utopia that the anti gunners point to and say, ” we should be more like them”?
    2) I would love to hear piers explanation of how this could have happened in such a “civilized” society.

  26. avatar Retired LEO says:

    Britain changed God save the Queen to Allah save the mullah, right.

    Sadly it’s coming to us in the not distant future.Barack Hussein Obama golfs as the country burns. Guess the bunkers (sand traps) remind him of paradise

    1. avatar great unknown says:

      You know, Allah Save The Mullah has a nice ring to it.

    2. avatar vix says:

      Your hysteria about Islam, Asians abs even your own president shows you Terrorise YOURSELF… those are ideas of your own making, you drive fear into your own heart

      Tim McLean was not a terrorist attack and being American did not save him, nor did any gun and his killer is still alive. ..

      Wake up to reality and stop being your own Terrorist

      1. avatar PeterZ in West Tennessee says:

        Tim McLain was killed in Canada by a man from China. What does that have to do with guns in the US?

  27. avatar Jon says:

    “This was a highly visible attack in broad daylight on a residential street. I can understand why this may cause people concern, however we are confident that we are not looking for anyone else at this stage… “

    And that should make people confident that no one else is going to take a machete and do the same thing – Yup, I totally see it. There is obviously no reason anyone has to arm themselves.

    1. avatar Richard In WA says:

      Yup. No one has ever been attacked by a machete before and it will most certainly never happen again. The first and only machete violence to ever occur happened this momentous day, 09-04-14.

      Nothing to see here, move along, move along.

      1. avatar vix says:

        So tell me how guns saved Tim McClean?

        1. avatar uncommon_sense says:

          Vix,

          First of all, Tim McClean was in Canada where NO ONE is armed in public. I will repeat the relevant facts: Tim McClean was in Canada. Tim McClean was not armed. No one else on Tim McClean’s bus was armed. That is why no one was able to stop Mr. McClean’s attacker.

          Back in the United States, an attacker tried a similar stunt in a WalMart store — an armed patron promptly shot the attacker and saved the victim’s life. Here is a link to the story: http://www.abqjournal.com/news/metro/384771metro08-27-05.htm

          I can assure you, no one will ever pull out a knife, sword, or machete and successfully decapitate anyone while armed good people are close by.

        2. avatar uncommon_sense says:

          I see Vix has no response for my example where an armed patron shot and stopped an attacker who was stabbing his estranged wife in a store.

          That is just one of countless, verifiable, documented instances where a good person who was armed stopped a violent attacker and saved a life.

  28. avatar Gunr says:

    Lets get the NRA to start a chapter in the UK??

    1. avatar vix says:

      So IRA? actually hysterical here!

      Does anyone think before posting?

      We don’t need this brand of stupid over here, especially not one brandishing a gun … stay away thanks

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        So, NRA = IRA?

        Your trolling has been entertaining, but this is just abjectly pathetic.

        1. avatar vix says:

          International Rifle Association would product the initials IRA

          trolling? Are you trolling if I don’t agree with you? I suggest you take some time to digest that someone who does not share your opinion is a troll?

        2. avatar JR_in_NC says:

          I called you a troll because you have been trolling.

          You are posting using provocative language, nonsense “statistics” that are easily refuted, ask for a case and when given one ignore it and continue arguing a non-defensible position, repeatedly bring up a case that has no relevance to the discussion and a host of other trollish behaviors.

          I don’t care if you are anti-gun, or if you agree with me or not. There are a LOT of people on here with whom I’ve had disagreements that I do not / have not called troll. There have been anti-gun writers on here commenting that I have not called troll.

          I have called people troll or trollish though they agree with me on gun rights. I think I’ve been so called by other gun owners.

          It’s a manner and style of commenting that leads me to call someone a troll. Trolling is a form of communication.

          So, another incorrect fact: I called you troll because you disagree with me.

          Now, address why you repeatedly bring up a Canadian case that as some evidence of something of relevance to US gun laws. Or cite some data that shows the US leads the world in violent crime and that it is because of gun ownership in the US.

          Or, cite one example of an armed US woman raped.

          Or, show one study that shows the US population is safer without guns than it is with them. Or, one study that shows crime goes up with increased gun ownership.

          You keep bringing up all this stuff without and substance, even though you have been repeatedly ‘called’ on it by various folks. THAT is the behavior of a troll, not someone wanting to have an honest discussion.

        3. avatar vix says:

          You’re constantly taking the debate off topic to make personal attacks so you are the troll

          I make my points and you throw tantrums and ignore what I say because you’re aiming to detail the truth. .. that makes you the troll

          I pointed out where you had missed (big surprise) my point that to set up NRA outside of NATIONAL boundaries makes it INTERNATIONAL thus IRA as the initials to write a diatribe about me .. you sir are definitely a true troll

        4. avatar JR_in_NC says:

          Asking you to provide, or stick to facts is off topic? Wow.

          “I make my points and you throw tantrums”

          No tantrums, just pointing out the FACT that you cannot back up what you say with ANY evidence whatsoever, continue to LIE about your assertions and ignore data when given to you.

          If that hurts your precious feelings, go home. The big boys are trying to have real discussions here.

          “and ignore what I say because you’re aiming to detail the truth”

          Huh? I / we ignore what you say because you are wrong. I don’t know what “aiming to detail the truth” means in your fantasy laden world view, but for must of us, the truth can, in the case of violent crime and gun ownership correlates, be easily supported by facts and evidence.

          I would NEVER have called you a troll if you had, for example, said, “Oh, I see. I never realized the data show that. I was wrong.” It is your quite baffling adhesion to being wrong that earns stronger replies.

          Too, I like the trick of waiting a few days without replying, and then coming back for another wave of trolling this comment section in the hopes of getting the last word or something. Like a petulant, spoiled child, you just won’t give up, will you? You think if you repeat your provably wrong nonsense enough on here those of us with functioning neurons will magically ignore the facts and join you in your communal fantasy that guns themselves are “the problem?”

          Man, you are just pathetic. I really feel sorry for you. I cannot fathom for one instance how anyone can CHOOSE to be stupid. But, hey, it’s your life, and unlike you, WE are willing to leave you the hell alone to think what you want. We are not trying to pass all kinds of laws that limit you from thinking whatever factually incorrect garbage you want to think.

    2. avatar Sian says:

      UK and Ireland have their own National Rifle Associations since the 1850’s.

  29. avatar tmm says:

    He will be assessed by psychiatrists, tested for drugs and questioned by Homicide and Major Crimes officers

    …In that order?

  30. avatar Anon says:

    In the UK, any sort of weapon or tool being carried for self-defence will get you locked up. Even a small pocket knife if you say its for protection rather than a tool

  31. avatar vix says:

    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Tim_McLean

    USA man beheaded on bus… so not quite NEVER happened in the us

    1. avatar LordGopu says:

      Can you stfu about Tim McLean please? You seriously said it like 4 times. You clearly have no reading comprehension skills because you just linked to the wiki article and you still didn’t realize that Tim was Canadian and was in Canada when the crime occurred. So it has nothing to do with what anyone is talking about here. There is no concealed carry here in Canada.

      And while we’re at it, do you think that guns have mind control powers? Do they have psychic powers to make people do things they wouldn’t normally? Cuz I don’t think they do and that pretty well negates any worthless argument that more guns = more crime.

      Why don’t you look at severe social problems that raise generations of kids in high crime areas and other factors that produce violence in our countries?

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        I think it is one of Alinsky’s rules for brain-dead sheep to ignore facts at all costs.

        1. avatar vix says:

          http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States

          These are facts you cannot ignore

          I apologise for my error in the Tim McClean case as I had heard it was a USA case

        2. avatar uncommon_sense says:

          Vix,

          No one is claiming that there is no violent crime in the United States. Here are three facts to put our violent crime in perspective:
          (1) Around 80% of violent crime in the United States are cases where a criminal attacked another criminal. (Read violent gangs attacking rival violent gangs.)
          (2) Virtually ALL violent crime happens in urban centers where poverty and broken families are rampant.
          (3) The murder rate in the United States, where the criminal used something other than a firearm to kill their victim, is still higher than the murder rate in Western European countries.

          Why does the U.S. have a higher murder rate than Western European countries? Because we have a long history of broken families living in poverty in densely populated urban centers. If you are not a criminal and live outside of a poor urban center, the murder rate is very low. If you are not a criminal and live in a rural area of the United States, the violent crime and murder rates are lower than any Western European country.

        3. avatar J. Zoss says:

          Arguing with confidence about something you heard. I bet you have to apologize a lot for errors with those fact checking skills. You never even started with any credibility to lose.

  32. avatar LordGopu says:

    So I’ll say it again vix, do guns have magic powers that make people commit crimes against their will? Because I think it’s more likely a social issue in the US more than an inanimate object making people do bad things.

    Some people blame the media for glorifying these killers, some blame mental illness, some blame people in poor areas with little education, gangs, etc… But those at least make sense. The violence in the US is almost certainly a combination of all those things depending on the specific case/type of crime.

    But that said, there are easier ways to kill people than firing a gun at moving targets. You could go rent a truck at uhaul and crash it through large crowds of people (like a protest or parade or line up or any gathering of people). Hell you could do it at a school. Call in a fake bomb threat so they evacuate and then plow a truck through the crowd when they pile up outside.

    Not to mention sandy hook wouldn’t have been any different with a melee weapon. Kids can’t fight back; maybe that’s why he chose that target. Kill the adult and the classroom of little kids isn’t going to stop you.

    Please stop making illogical connections that because the US has a lot of guns this somehow causes other things. What you see is correlation not causation.

    1. avatar vix says:

      It’s flying over your heads so high it’s hilarious

      You are outraged that I talk about you having guns on a story about the UK saying WE should have them. .. you read it right?

      If USA gun ownership is no business of the UK people then stop commenting on a London story

  33. avatar uncommon_sense says:

    Vix,

    In a response above I cited the story where an estranged husband began viciously stabbing his estranged wife at a Wal-Mart store. Please explain how the armed patron who shot the attacker did not stop the attacker.

    1. avatar J. Zoss says:

      I am guessing he ran out of incorrect things he heard about to get wrong. Possibly overwhelmed by reading too many facts. He apparently can’t conceive that a gun can and is used to save lives. Many times no shots are fired, the person doesn’t report it and even if they did it would not be newsworthy. People that have never been here and believe everything they read sometimes have the impression that the average person in the US is ducking for cover on a daily basis.

    2. avatar vix says:

      I didn’t ask you for one example, I pointed out the fact that the attacks outnumber the defence stories

      That numberS. .. I know you learn Math and we learn maths so I felt it fair to point it out again

      YW

  34. avatar Yellow Devil says:

    After reading Vix’s “comments” I’m guessing Pierced Moran (Pierce Morgan) is trying to claw his way back into the lime light, one gun website at a time.

    1. avatar vix says:

      I’m female… you didn’t get that?

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        Why does that matter?

        Does being female, or bringing it up in this conversation, give you some sort of power we should know about?

  35. avatar neiowa says:

    vix

    Do the authorities know you’re out and on the internet again?. And off your meds?

    1. avatar vix says:

      Not been committed or prescribed medication but feel free to write rubbish if your IQ does not allow you to formulate and articulate a well thought out opinion

      It reflects well the points I have made about the cognitive levels of people such as yourself… maybe baby Jesus Santa can bring you a new gun for Christmas so you can simply shoot your way into a debate next time

  36. avatar Ethnic Russian says:

    > Even in a police state, there aren’t enough police to protect the populace

    A man can not be more right than this.

    In Moscow region in Russia there are now serial murderers gang. They atack mostly drivers, dropping spikes on the road to force people to stop and install spare tire. And they are shooting people by some 9-mm handguns. Licencing and concealable arms prohibition “surprisingly” have not prevented them from getting 3.

    And people cant defend themselves, because we live in police state and populace have no right to carry a loaded firearm, no right for concealable guns and licensing is heavily regulated. More than 20 people are already murdered on the roads.

    We have cameras everywhere, our mobile phones voice and positioning are recoded, all our internet traffic is recorded by law, they even made DNA-database on citizens.

    What can police do with this to defend disarmed people? Police cant do shit!

    In UK lefts say “thats because of political correctness we see no rapes and murders”, but that is bullshit. Even if they see something as big as a gang of murderers, they just dont give a fuck. Hiding the truth and hand picking intelligence to look good in their media and have someone to blame is enough for them.

    1. avatar LordGopu says:

      Apparently the UK is full of that corruption too. I don’t remember if I saw it here on ttag or not but there were reports that the police were purposely underreporting crimes for bonuses. Like they would write “attempted murder” as “vandalism” because the bullet broke a window.

      This was in mainstream newspapers as well as from those police bloggers like inspector gadget.

  37. avatar janitor says:

    dear 8lb 8oz baby jesus, thank you for letting me be born american.

  38. avatar rlc2 says:

    Apparently the attacker was a random crazy, as opposed to a jihadi crazy beheader-

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/woman-beheaded-details-emerge-of-edmonton-suspect-nicholas-salvadore-9714526.html

    What? WHAT? did I say something, non-PC? Well. Excuussssseee ME!

    http://www.nationalreview.com/article/386920/real-rape-culture-rich-lowry

  39. avatar rlc2 says:

    RF’s point is still the same:

    When seconds count, the police are only minutes away.

  40. avatar DTAL says:

    Hard to feel sympathy for people who get exactly what they ask for.

    Violence won’t stop just because you relieved yourself of the means to protect yourself. It just means you’ll die more horrifically.

Write a Comment

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

button to share on facebook
button to tweet
button to share via email