Rube Goldberg v. Actual School Safety

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Now I’ve seen it all. A recent article by Paul Hughes made two primary suggestions relating to school safety: 1) schools remain unsafe because there is too much emphasis on active shooter response, and 2) the best way to ensure school safety is to buy the G8 Pro V2, which its manufacturer–Guardian 8–bills as “enhanced non-lethal, low-impact de-escalation for crisis situations.” I initially thought the article was a parody. After visiting the company’s “Learning About the G8 Pro V2″  website, I’m not entirely certain it isn’t . . .

The G8 Pro V2 is a silver, gun-shaped combination “laser spotter” (apparently a common laser sight), small strobe light, “alerting siren,” digital camera, and pepper spray dispenser. It also has a Bluetooth transmitter that apparently sends a “pre-recorded alert message to your pre-programmed number” via a user’s cellphone. One has to call the company for a price quote. I couldn’t bring myself to do it.

According to Guardian 8, a “Level 1 Response,” consists of turning on an “arming switch,” which activates the “laser spotter” and the digital camera. Apparently the unit makes some kind of sound–an “audible notification”–when a level 1 response occurs. A “Level 2 Response” entails partially pulling the trigger, which adds the strobe light and the siren and sends the pre-recorded message. A “Level 3 Response,” is really exciting. This involves a complete pull of the trigger, which shoots pepper spray, adding it to the laser pointer, the flashing strobe, the screaming siren, and the recording camera. Users will be comforted to know: “The pepper spray will continue as long as the trigger remains fully depressed, or until the canister is depleted (whichever comes first).”

Potential G8 Pro V2 users will be gratified to learn that the unit has an “illuminated sight,” which appears to be a green light at the back of the device–there are no actual gun-like sights–a LED “status indicator,” an on/off switch, a speaker–I’m not sure why–and a USB port to connect the unit to a computer for video download.

I’ll have to paraphrase Jeff Cooper: this is a non-ingenious solution to a non-existent problem.

We are fortunate indeed that active shooters in schools are, in reality, extremely rare. For the time being, kids are actually quite safe–statistically at least–at school from people who want to murder them. Unfortunately, our borders are wide open and international and domestic terrorist organizations are recruiting and growing in both their number and their wanton barbarism. Attacking major structures with captured airliners is difficult. Targeting soft targets like schools is not and is highly likely to result in enormous casualty counts. Terrorists have been attacking schools elsewhere in the world for decades, but that’s a topic for another time.

Because the odds favor children and teachers most of the time does not mean that active shooter attacks are impossible or that the possibility can be ignored. They do occur, and the odds are always against someone. There is no reason the odds can’t be against any school anywhere at any time, particularly if that school’s safety plan amounts to nothing more than run, hide, and — as a last resort — use unarmed children to try to overwhelm armed killers.

If that’s all they have, it’s better than nothing, but like any so-called “plan” that doesn’t take the threat seriously, it anticipates and accepts a certain minimum level of wounded and dead teachers and kids rather than deterring active shooters and stopping them where possible. After all, if a rush of unarmed children doesn’t stop the killer, what will? In these attacks, seconds equal lives.

The ultimate question that matters — the only question that matters — is what a school can and will do when the worst-case scenario comes to pass. When an active shooter (or shooters) is approaching a school or has already started his attack, what is that school ready and able to do to immediately stop that shooter and save lives?

In virtually no Ameircan active shooter incident of the modern era have the police played any role in stopping the killers or saving lives. Time and distance matter. At Sandy Hook Elementary, it took the first police officer just under 15 minutes to enter the building. By that time, the killer had murdered 26 students and teachers and had himself been dead about five minutes by his own hand. And that was an unusually rapid police response.

The G8 Pro V2 is billed as a “non-lethal device,” and so it is. Imagine facing an armed killer approaching you in a school hallway armed only with a device that was blaring an annoying siren, flashing a small strobe light, and squirting pepper spray. If a teacher is extremely lucky and the killer was within range of the pepper spray, he might be sneezing a bit as he shoots and kills her, which gunshots might be captured on video before the contraption is dropped to the floor. More likely, he’d simply kill her from a distance and avoid the sneezing altogether. Other than helping to aim the pepper spray that would likely be out of range, it’s hard to imagine what the laser would accomplish.

It seems the G8 Pro V2 would do little more than make a teacher an attractive and annoying target, with the added benefit of possibly recording a few seconds of very low resolution–the device records at one megapixel, which resolution is surpassed by most cellphones–video before being gunned down. And I suspect this great leap forward in school safety is anything but cheap.

Only arming willing teachers and other school personnel with concealed handguns — and widely advertising that fact — while carefully withholding details as to how many teachers are carrying and on which campuses, will provide actual protection rather than the illusion of safety.

Running and hiding? Of course. When under armed attack, it’s idiotic not to run from the threat or to find cover, or at least, concealment. If you’re about to be shot, by all means, throw anything damaging you can pick up. Attack the killer en masse and hurt him in any way possible. But why would any rational adult knowingly put children in that position? Why would they withhold the only truly effective means of deterring attacks and saving lives?

As an educator, I know that many teachers and administrators are politically predisposed to fear, even hate guns and people who own, appreciate and use them. Some are so afraid of these inanimate objects as to make one doubt their sanity. This is, for many school districts, a built-in barrier to actual school safety rather than merely feeling safe. Some politicians have the same beliefs and fears, and they, too reflexively resist saving lives.

Such people’s arguments usually reflect a complete lack of knowledge and understanding of firearms and their employment. Many don’t want to learn, believing, or at least purporting to believe, that the mere presence of a firearm in a school–even carried by a police officer–is dangerous, evil, morally wrong and sends a message to the children that their school supports violence or that they are not safe.

And they are safe, until they aren’t. But some people would rather maintain their pure ideology and moral superiority than equip themselves to actually save lives if the generally favorable odds turn against them and the children whose safety is their responsibility.

This is akin to refusing to outfit schools with fire extinguishers on the theory that their presence sends the message that the school supports fires, that they’re safe without them. They are, until they’re not.

The overwhelming majority of school children will never have to face an armed attack in their school, and they will never have to face a fire either, but there is no reason why either cannot happen to them. Firearms are like fire extinguishers. When you need one, you need it immediately, badly, and nothing else will do.

There are also state laws that prevent carrying firearms in school zones, as if the signs that accompany such laws will stop those bent on mass murder from violating a lesser law with lesser penalties. However, any law can be changed.

Even with these powerful obstacles, America is becoming more pro-liberty, and more pro-gun. Where it was once very difficult to carry concealed weapons anywhere, it is now commonplace and only a few states and cities still significantly hamper the right of their citizens to self-defense. The next freedom movement can be to arm teachers to protect students, to preserve the most important right: the right to life, secured by the right to self-defense.

And why not? We protect our money with extraordinary measures, including firearms. Our politicians are protected with armed and highly trained personal security. We allow concealed weapons virtually everywhere, and years of experience have proved that those carrying concealed handguns are among the safest and most law-abiding people anywhere. Will teachers–at least some of whom are already concealed carry licensees–do worse?

Lesser measures like the G8 Pro V2 are dangerous placebos. Long guns locked away in safes or centrally-located armories or lock boxes in teachers’ rooms are useless to anyone caught outside their room, in a hallway, on the playground, waiting for school busses. And what if the person with the key or combination is in the bathroom, off campus or has already been shot by an attacker. That doesn’t mean that appropriate long guns shouldn’t be contemplated, but the first line of defense must be concealed handguns, carried on the person. Only then can they be readily available when and where they are needed. Only then can they be kept safe from mishandling or theft.

Rube Goldberg devices like the G8 Pro V2, ballistic white boards, bullet-resistant backpacks, and all manner of other devices, programs and policies cannot deter an attacker, and they absolutely can’t stop an attacker. Only well-placed bullets can do that.

Anti-liberty and self-defense advocates will do all they can to prevent or hamper the efforts of people actually concerned with safety rather than feeling safe. They will demand, and try to legislate, all manner of unnecessary training, restrictions and rules that make it difficult or impossible for any competent teacher to protect themselves or their students. But with determination, and an eye on the long view, that every student and teacher in America be truly protected from ultimate evil, one day they may be.

Mike’s Home blog is Stately McDaniel Manor.

comments

  1. avatar dlj95118 says:

    …pew! pew, pew pew!

    1. avatar ready,fire,aim says:

      …pew…zing

      1. avatar archangel187 says:

        Buzz: I’ve set my laser from stun to kill.
        Woody: Oh, great. If anyone attacks we can blink em’ to death.

        1. avatar Robert W. says:

          OMG, I think I might have peed a little laughing at that!

      2. avatar Omer says:

        Wouldn’t it be a whoop whoop, flash flash, squirt until it’s all gone. Then a pew pew with video for posterity.

  2. avatar Allen says:

    I’m sure every police officer in the country is going to want this to replace his gun.

    1. avatar Steve Day says:

      Some LEO’s in this country NEED to have their guns replaced with one of these!

      Let’s start with anyone that has shot an animal that was posing no threat to anyone and the douchebags who think it’s fine to aim their guns at people (with booger pickers on the bang switch) when their lives are not being threatened.

  3. avatar Jeremy in AL says:

    That is ridiculous.
    While not an option for everyone, not sending your children to government schools may be the best.
    They are unprotected.
    They are getting their brains filled with liberal mush.
    Homeschool. Private school if you can’t. Don’t let .gov raise your kids.

    1. avatar Rokurota says:

      There are many reasons to homeschool, but avoiding the rare school attack is low on the list (IMO). This is the same variety of response as “don’t patronize retail stores” and “don’t work for anyone but yourself.” Retreat from the world is not practical or desirable for all of us.

      1. avatar Jeremy in AL says:

        Concur. Raising little statists is the main concern.

      2. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        “but avoiding the rare school attack is low on the list (IMO).”

        Agreed, but there are other safety concerns at public school as well. Exposure to generally low brow behavior is among them.

        “Retreat from the world is not practical or desirable for all of us.”

        Homeschooling is not retreating from the world. My family is very active in our community, as are many of the other homeschooling families we know.

        See how far the “government institution is the Right Way” meme extends? ANYTHING that contradicts it must inherently be inferior, right?

        Bottom line, there are a LOT of reasons to homeschool, and not one single good reason to keep kids in public school for the hugest majority of people.

    2. avatar Muddy Waters says:

      I went to public school my whole life, as did my father, and so on. I had extremely conservative teachers and extremely liberal teachers. How about you just teach your kids to think for themselves and have their own value systems. Quite frankly, schools these days don’t have the resources to even keep the football team/ school band afloat, much less indoctrinate your children. I’d be more concerned about letting your kids be raised by their TV or Xbox.

      1. avatar Albaniaaaa says:

        How many of a child’s waking hours are at school? Do the math, too many. Not to mention the failure of schools to educate. Look at what they were modelled after. The prussian model of schooling… Look where that led. Read John Taylor Gatto.

        1. avatar Rokurota says:

          Or worse, John Dewey, the father of our modern public schools.

          However, I don’t think the answer is to yield the high ground. See my comment below.

        2. avatar cuzwhat says:

          “How many of a child’s waking hours are at school? Do the math, too many.”

          let’s be generous and say that a child spends 8 hours a day in school and 8 hours a day asleep.

          That child also spends 180 days in school, and 185 out.

          having done the math, it seems a child spends about 50% of 50% of his waking hours in school, and the other 75% of his waking hours out of it.

          Meanwhile, in school, that child is seeing teachers in a 23:1 ratio, while at home, that child is seeing parents in a 1:1 or even 1:2 ratio.

          If a static life-long parent, dealing with a child one on one for 3/4 of his waking hours cannot overwhelm the influence of an ever changing series of school teachers…I don’t think the school is the problem.

      2. avatar Jonathan - Houston says:

        Oh that’s great and simple advice: just teach your kids to think for themselves. Children don’t automatically have the capability either to think for themselves or to learn to do so, beyond basic instinct levels. These things take years of patience and dilligent instruction.

        It’s very fashionable today just to hand kids over to the schoools, turn children loose and allow them to “explore” and “discover” the subject matter. That’s b.s. The ideas and and principles presented in formal education are the product of many centuries, many lifetimes, the life’s work of many men and women of genius, courage, and perseverance. It takes a long time before students are even remotely up to speed and equipped with the critical reasoning skills to begin formulating their own ideas after having been guided through this material.

        Before reaching that point, however, they’re vulnerable and highly susceptible to years of daily indoctrination in the angers, resentments, distortions, revisionism and fabrications that are the hallmarks of the public school system. In those years, the public schools corrupt and co-opt the learning process, preventing students from even obtaining an authentic education.

        It will take far more effort, and a real plan, to educate children and defend them from indoctrination, beyond just a simple directive to teach them to think for themselves.

    3. avatar Rokurota says:

      Once again, we have the suggestion to abandon the field to the enemy. I disagree. We do not homeschool for a variety of reasons, but we stay very involved — I am on the PTA board and we have cultivated very close relations with teachers and administrators and school board members. We always check the textbooks and what they are studying, and are satisfied their lessons are sufficiently even-handed and patriotic. Fortunately, we live in a district that is not teeming with indoctrination either liberal or conservative, but we always reserve the option of homeschooling or private school should we feel the situation is untenable. We are not afraid of exempting our kids from “family life” class and letting our kids know why they are not attending. It is hard at first, but now my older son understands and agrees with our rationale. He is one of very few classmates who is not an Obama fan (we talk a lot of politics at the dinner table) and is not afraid to say so. Everyone knows my sons shoot and they have invited friends to the range under my supervision (and with their parents’ approval). I am also a Scout leader and make sure riflery, archery and knife skills are a part of their training.

      We agree with and defend homeschooling and private schools, but as long as we have public schools — and as long as they are a benefit to our kids — we are not skedaddling, but evangelizing.

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        “as long as we have public schools — and as long as they are a benefit to our kids”

        It is certainly debatable as to whether they are now, or indeed ever have been, a benefit to our kids.

        Or, perhaps better stated, of MORE benefit to our kids.

        Once upon a time, everyone homeschooled. It is the natural state for parents to raise their children. Institutionalized schooling is recent in the course of human history. Literacy has since decreased, and all manners of other, secondary problems have arisen.

        You can argue the merits of your school district all you want. “Good” does not equal “Better.”

        1. avatar Rokurota says:

          Just because you homeschool, it does not mean it’s better for everyone. My wife and I belong to a church where quite a few parents, including the pastor and his wife, homeschool. We support them; we have prayed about it; we have talked about it, and it just isn’t going to happen for us. First, homeschooling requires one parent to not work. You can argue all you want about how one shouldn’t place a comfortable living above your children, but what about all the real working class parents? Are they somehow lesser parents because they work $10/hr jobs? Second, you can’t always have “best,” at least not in every aspect of life. We do not live in the best neighborhood, have the best schools, and have the best jobs, but we also see our kids a lot, have a very low debt load, and are where we’re called to be. For now.

          I agree — to a point — that homeschool does not have to equal retreat. I am a contentious sort and like to provide dissent where it is needed (and it is needed everywhere). That is why we are involved with the PTA, the local bar, and the city’s environmental advisory board — to provide what may be the lone voices of sane conservatism. You fight your battles your way, and I’ll fight mine. And please don’t imply I’m a government stooge just because I don’t do as you do. Like I said, we didn’t “default” to “government schools,” and we didn’t come to the decision lightly.

        2. avatar JR_in_NC says:

          “Just because you homeschool, it does not mean it’s better for everyone. “

          The thing is, though, all the arguments we always hear against it have nothing whatsoever to do with the quality of the education itself and what is best for the children.

          All of them.

          These conversations always go with some variation of “I’d love to homeschool, but…” and what follows is never, ever anything like “my children will learn more | better in public school.”

          That’s what I was addressing. Public school serves a purpose, but it is (a) not even necessarily education that is the purpose and (b) not the best at it’s purported purpose.

          “And please don’t imply I’m a government stooge just because I don’t do as you do.”

          Where did I do that? I don’t believe I did, either implicitly or explicitly, state any such thing.

          Glad you are happy with your choice. At least you made the choice deliberately rather than just “defaulting” to it, as you put it. That’s more than most folks do.

        3. avatar Rokurota says:

          JR, you are probably right. All things being equal, homeschool is (most of the time) better than public school. As you can probably detect, we have been the target of some judgment for “letting the State raise our kids.” Thanks for clarifying.

  4. avatar Bobby McKellar says:

    This is an actual excerpt from the site:

    Pro V2 adds several layers of defense to this strategy:

    RUN
    Leave the area of danger immediately and seek cover or concealment in accordance with a practiced response plan. Armed Pro V2 immediately activates incident recording. A partial trigger pull sends a distress call to a responder of your choice.
    HIDE
    If unable to leave the area, seek cover or concealment. Prior to taking cover/concealment, an option to deter a threatening individual is to deploy Pro V2’s O.C. pepper spray gel formula into the area where an active shooter may enter to cause an immediate aversion to entering.
    FIGHT
    If confronted with an aggressive threat, deploy Pro V2′s strobe light and siren to disorient, and deploy pepper spray toward target. Temporarily incapacitate the attacker.

    Sounds like the French response except for the “FIGHT” part! LOL

    1. avatar outwardhound says:

      Off topic for a bit, but I’ve got to challenge the poke at the French. I’m not French, or a francophile, or even generally fond of Europeans in particular, but the common perception of French unwillingness to fight seems to me to be greatly mistaken. While the joke about a used French rifle being never fired and only dropped once is funny, it is inaccurate. For example, France, with a significantly smaller population and much smaller industrial base, essentially fought Germany alone during the first years of WWI and suffered staggering casualties from which it hadn’t fully recovered by the onset of WWII when it again had to face the onslaught of the German might essentially alone. Tuchman’s “Guns of August” is a great read and good starting point to appreciate the bravery and resolve of the French.

      1. avatar the ruester says:

        They also helped us with the revolution but that isn’t FUNNY 🙂

      2. avatar Ryan says:

        I don’t think anyone who has served with the French in OEF or worked with any of their legionnaires would call them cowards.

    2. avatar Stinkeye says:

      Looks like they left off the fourth step of that sequence: DIE.

      Pepper spray has its uses, but going mano a mano with just pepper spray against a determined attacker with a gun? Suicide.

  5. avatar Shire-man says:

    So it’s a machine that wets your pants and screams help for you?
    With one pull of the trigger cries for help ring out and a foul stench permeates the air.
    Only $9,999.95. Extort money from your neighbor to buy yourself one today!

  6. avatar blackspike2710 says:

    The most advanced non lethal solution to an active school shooter, and it can only be defeated by a set of earplugs and swimming goggles.

    1. avatar Raul Ybarra says:

      Then we need to ban them as well.

  7. avatar Clark45 says:

    Well said, Mike. The idea that we must try to use some non-lethal, “politically correct” means to stop these killers is absurd. No question that some of them have some mental disorder – a couple anti’s that I have talked to seem to think that this fact means we should try to “save” them & “treat” them – but mental disorder or not, once they show up at a school or workplace armed & intending/trying to kill, the only real solution is potentially lethal force. No goofy gizmo with flashing lights & “scary” noises is going to save any lives because it simply won’t stop the attacker. And there is plenty of proof that a well placed hollow-point in a variety of calibers will stop the attackers.

    Now, if we could only get the right people to understand this.

  8. avatar Pascal says:

    Given the range for the pepper spray is only 10ft as stated on their website, what are you going to do when someone has a gun and can reach you at over 20ft?

    1. avatar A-Rod says:

      Also, pepper spray does not have a compounding effect. More pepper spray does not mean more pain. One hit, even a small amount or a near miss, is full effect.

    2. avatar Geoff PR says:

      A 10 oz bottle of Bear pepper spray has a range of 30 feet for about 30-40 bucks.

      30 feet is better, but zero comparison to ballistic copper-jacketed lead with a 15 round dispenser.

  9. avatar Dirk Diggler says:

    they forgot to include the bright neon yellow vest for the user to wear so the coroner can identify the body better.

  10. avatar Accur81 says:

    I’m curious how much that piece if shit G8 costs. Corporate price for my First Defense .2% police grade OC spray is probably less than $9 / unit with a max range of 15-18 feet. No sights needed. Plus, winds blows OC / water and it drops pretty fast anyways. A laser sight on such a contraption would be asinine.

    And of course a GLOCK / XD / M&P runs about $500, depending on options (corporate price starts less than $400).

    If anyone is in the Brea / OC area and wants to spray me with a G8 I’ll see how well I can still engage targets. I make no such offers with real guns.

      1. avatar Stinkeye says:

        Wow. A $10 digital camera, a $10 pepper-spray canister, and a $5 LED flashlight, plus a little electronics to make fun siren noises somehow adds up to almost $300? Impressive profit margin!

        I gotta get into this business. I’ll add a couple Picatinny rails and one of those cheapo Daisy red-dot sights they sell for Airsoft, and produce it in ten different fashion colors. That ought to be worth another couple hundred bucks, right?

        Seriously, $279? That money would be much better spent on a Ruger LCP or Taurus TCP.

        1. avatar Jus Bill says:

          As P. T. Barnum said…

    1. avatar Geoff PR says:

      In your LEO training, were you nailed with the same type pepper spray you were issued?

      1. avatar Accur81 says:

        I’ve been pepper sprayed multiple times – on duty, off duty, and to clear sinuses as a last resort. I’ve been hit with the police grade stuff we carry, as well as lower quality OC. I’m not immune, but the effects are much less drastic than the first time I was sprayed – which was in a YMCA self defense class around 1993.

  11. avatar Joe R. says:

    How many times, in how many ways, do they have to continue to tell you that they can’t protect your kids at school before you tell them you believe them. Don’t settle for “can’t” but still give in to piles of stupid demands.

    If anyone says “I cannot protect you unless you _________________”. Only the first part of the statement is true. When government says it, tell whatever mouthpiece spewed it “Good, now pack your sh_t and go home”

  12. avatar Taylor TX says:

    i wonder what the pressure difference is for a partial trigger pull and full trigger pull?

    Teachers accidentally mash the pepper switch in panic and now theyve sprayed themselves and are somewhat incapacitated? GG

  13. avatar Jim Barrett says:

    “Even with these powerful obstacles, America is becoming more pro-liberty, and more pro-gun. Where it was once very difficult to carry concealed weapons anywhere, it is now commonplace and only a few states and cities still significantly hamper the right of their citizens to self-defense.”

    Unfortunately, while the pro-liberty movement is growing in many places, the pro-restriction movement is growing in others. Residents in Colorado, Connecticut, NY, NJ, MA, and California enjoy fewer gun freedoms today than they did two years ago. It is unlikely that trend is going to change.

    I agree that armed good guys are the best deterrent, but unfortunately, America has a habit of preparing to fight past battles. Most Police active shooter training today focuses on one or two assailants rather than an organized attack by multiple trained adversaries similar to what happened at Beslan or in Mumbai. Until a few of these happen, we are not likely to change our methods of preparation.

    1. avatar Stinkeye says:

      “Residents in Colorado, Connecticut, NY, NJ, MA, and California enjoy fewer gun freedoms today than they did two years ago.”

      But at least in CO, several of the legislators who brought those restrictions now enjoy much more free time than they did two years ago. I suspect that the upcoming elections will truly show which direction the pendulum is swinging, and I think it’s far more in our direction than theirs, even in the worst anti-gun cesspools.

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        And Castle Rock was just in the news a couple days ago.

        And the restaurant(s) in Colorado that not only allow, but encourage Open Carry.

        No, I don’t think CO was the best state for the ‘decline’ example. True, the fight exists everywhere. We rest on our laurels at our peril. But there are places where it is crap and getting crappier.

      2. avatar Jim Barrett says:

        ” I suspect that the upcoming elections will truly show which direction the pendulum is swinging, and I think it’s far more in our direction than theirs, even in the worst anti-gun cesspools.”

        No, repealing anti-gun laws will show if things truly have turned around. Tossing three dumbass politicians buys you little in the short term and nothing in the long term. There is a boundless supply of dumbass politicians so more will come to fill the vacancies.

        If Colorado can toss these new restrictions, then I’ll concede that Colorado does not belong on my list. Otherwise, I stand by what I said – Colorado residents have fewer gun rights than they did 2 years ago.

        As for some of the other bastions of gun control. Good luck with that. Places like California, Massachusetts, and NJ just have too many people who think like MDA does – or simply choose not to think. Right thinking people are vastly outnumbered. Unfortunately.

        1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

          “If Colorado can toss these new restrictions, then I’ll concede that Colorado does not belong on my list. Otherwise, I stand by what I said – Colorado residents have fewer gun rights than they did 2 years ago.”

          A fair point, but there is a bit of “momentum” at work in politics and public opinion. Colorado has been sliding Statist for a looooonnnnnng time – slowly but steadily.

          I personally consider a check of that momentum a bit of a win. A small win, perhaps, but a powerful one whose full effects have not been realized yet. After all, we continue to get a lot of mileage out of the recall.

  14. avatar KingSarc48265 says:

    The only thing this device needs to be perfect would be to take off the siren, strobe light, pepper spray, and camera. Then add on a barrel, chamber, slide, magazine full of hollowpoints….The laser can stay though.

    1. avatar Garrison Hall says:

      They left out the pee dispenser.

      1. avatar Geoff PR says:

        It activates your OEM urine dispenser a few seconds before the shooter permanently shuts down your central nervous system.

  15. avatar Mediocrates says:

    awwww heck… just give each principal an “Active Shooter Whistle”. I feel better already….

  16. avatar Fug says:

    This will eventually be branded with “Beats by Dr. Dre” and sold as an implement for XTREME laser tag.

  17. avatar outwardhound says:

    One of the persistent arguments against arming teachers is weapon accessibility/security – a valid concern, but not an insurmountable problem. This device appears to be larger and bulkier than a standard service size pistol. If this can be safely secured in a classroom environment, certainly a pistol can. This device brings little potential benefit to school security when a more effective tool should be available to teachers/staff. That said, I’d take it if offered since I can’t carry at my school and my current self-defense tool consists of a “pointer” which is actually a hickory cane.

  18. avatar Shawn Graber says:

    Shire-Man beat me to it. I called the company’s provided number and was told that the units sell for $279.99. The engineer and salesman I talked to were both very friendly and helpful, although the salesman was concerned that I might be with a news media conglomerate. According to Salesman Dan, these are marketed toward private security companies.

    1. avatar Jus Bill says:

      According to Salesman Dan, these are marketed toward private security companies.

      Mainly because nobody else would be gullible enough to buy them.

    2. avatar Layne says:

      Not bad. I would have expected $2,799.99 if it were specifically intended to be purchased with tax dollars.

  19. avatar Mister Fleas says:

    10 years ago to this very day was when the Beslan hostage crisis was occurring. With threats by ISSI and an increased Muslim presence in the Western world, it will only be a matter of time before something like this happens in your own country.

    All of us should be doing 2 things:

    1. Demand your elected representative cut off Islamic immigration into your country. Letting Muslims into your country is no different than letting vampires into your country. No Muslims=no terrrorism

    2. Demand that school staff be allowed to arm themselves with lethal weapons.

    1. avatar A-Rod says:

      Troll comment. He thinks vampires are real. Please delete.

      1. avatar Ralph says:

        Wait — vampires aren’t real?

  20. avatar Garrison Hall says:

    Teachers and school administrators tend to be terminally pacific folk. The ones in my work experience tended to come from backgrounds where they’ve rarely had someone get really mad at them, let alone ever try to do them physical harm. They’ve never been in a fight, never had to extract themselves from a dangerous situation, rarely even felt threatened. Many grew up in environments where they were treated like hot-house flowers; protected, cossetted, and treated more like beloved pets than responsible adults. These are usually the kinds of folks who end up running the show. Teachers who were kids from the projects, red-necks, and the oil-patch are exceptions, of course, but they quickly learn that their careers depend on them forgetting everything they knew about defending oneself. That’s something that simply isn’t discussed in most schools. One thing that struck me after Sandy Hook was how angry school teachers were about what happened. They were angry that the teacher’s weren’t able to protect their kids. But they were even more angry about having to confront the reality that just one armed teacher could have saved the day. That was something they absolutely hated. People confronting their own denial for the first time often react that way.

    To any Person Of The Gun the G8 Pro V2 is silly beyond belief. It’s like the person who ties their front gate closed with string thinking that will protect their property. But to bunches of teachers who can’t imagine what something bad happening might actual be like, it makes a weird kind of sense. And these are the people watching out for our kids.

    1. avatar Ralph says:

      Teachers’ responses are exactly what I would expect from people who graduated in the bottom third of their class.

      I like school teachers, at least those who aren’t union flunkies, but let’s face facts. While there are some exceptionally smart teachers, most aren’t.

      1. avatar Vhyrus says:

        I remember when I was going to school for my engineering degree. Every time I met an education major, she (it was always a she) would ask me about what sort of things I am learning. It would take me about 45 seconds showing her basic free body diagram equations or Newtons Laws before her eyes would grow huge and she would look at me like some master wizard and say “woooow…. you must be really smart.”

        1. avatar Jus Bill says:

          Just try explaining computers and basic networking to someone like that. Like trying to describe nuclear technology to a stone age society.

  21. avatar the ruester says:

    What’s really sad is that these people are so terrified of anything even RESEMBLING a firearm that they will probably just lock this up in a safe anyway. Think about it; the same parents who worry that armed teachers might just suddenly decide to murder their children will simply hyperventilate at this new gizmo, wondering aloud if their little monster offspring might just be annoying enough to taze and pepper spray. I imagine that after all of this, actually getting this thing from it’s “secure location” will involve at least two people, sort of like retrieving nuclear launch codes. Even then, they still might insist on retrofitting this hilarious contraption with the ugly armatix watch thing, you know just to make extra double sure that no small child can ever overpower a grown ass man or woman and use this ridiculous piece of crap (not that they would want to since NERF guns would be way more effective anyway.) Maybe worst of all, having this radioactive box with a TOY gun inside that the adults have to invoke defcon 1 to open will only help to further brainwash the kids against guns… gee, who have I heard suggest doing THAT before?

  22. avatar Roll says:

    There are things like this already at the childrens toy aisle at Walmart…

    1. avatar Ralph says:

      Yeah, but if you pick one up, you’ll be shot to death by the po-po.

      http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/cops-shoot-and-kill-man-holding-toy-gun-walmart

  23. avatar Jack Brown says:

    At first I thought it was some kind of heat ray, but no, it was much stupider.

    1. avatar Jus Bill says:

      It belongs on Star Trek.

  24. avatar uncommon_sense says:

    “Many [school staff and policymakers] don’t want to learn, believing, or at least purporting to believe, that the mere presence of a firearm in a school–even carried by a police officer–is dangerous, evil, morally wrong and sends a message to the children that their school supports violence or that they are not safe.”

    This is the core problem with gun grabbers. Suggestions anyone on what to do about it? Do we try to truly educate them? Steamroll them?

    1. avatar Jus Bill says:

      Rotate them to an inner city school for a year. I think their attitudes may adjust a bit.

  25. avatar defensor fortisimo says:

    So one of the arguments trotted out against arming teachers is that they could potentially abuse the privilege, usually something to the tune of “I knew some teachers back in the day who would I would never trust with a gun.” So their solution is to give them a strobe light, siren and laser pointer all wrapped up in a nice OC package? I could easily envision someone trying to get a class attention with a siren, or the laser in a presentation and then it ending up with some 5th grader ending up with a face of pepper spray.

    If they trust teachers enough to follow one part of UOF, they should trust them with the rest.

    1. avatar Layne says:

      Since it has the stupidest control system ever devised for any purpose (half a trigger pull!?!?!?) I can easily see that happening. Luckily it has a camera on it so we can all see what happened after the students steal it and upload the video.

  26. avatar Roscoe says:

    Placebo is right; might as well arm up with an air soft.

  27. avatar C.S. says:

    I figured out the best way to use this thing: say “catch”, toss it at him, and bum rush the assailant. For the children…

  28. avatar Tex300BLK says:

    I think your only chance at this gimmick working are if the shooter mistakes it as an actual gun and blows his brains out thinking his prime-time is up.

  29. avatar CarlosT says:

    The Arapahoe High incident should have shown the way, but of course since it doesn’t play into the narrative, the lessons are ignored. Angry loner shows up with a shotgun and a bunch of molotov cocktails and immediately kills one student. The reason it’s not a total bloodbath is an armed sheriff’s deputy is there to confront him without delay. The killer ends his own life and untolled horror is avoided.

    Score one more for armed defense.

  30. avatar BDub says:

    Anyone that designs an emergency device that relies on a “partial pull” of a trigger, is an idiot!

    1. avatar Layne says:

      Seriously! Literally the worst idea I’ve ever heard. Did they bother to check anyone’s finger dexterity during a stressful situation? I bet it’s not good.

  31. avatar DerryM says:

    This G8 Pro V2 device kind of sounds like a scam conceived along the same lines as the anti’s propaganda, or maybe to take advantage of the anti’s propaganda to sell ignorant, willfully stupid people a product won’t work. But they cannot find-out it won’t work until it’s too late, then the Manufacturer says, “Well, it didn’t work because John/Jane Doe didn’t do it right, and/or should have used two (more) of them…” Sound familiar?

  32. avatar Raul Ybarra says:

    I don’t understand why everyone is being so hard on this gadget. I will certainly save the lives of some of the kids. Whoever has this thing is going to catch anyone from the first bullet to an entire magazine just by virtue of being so annoying. Those are bullets that won’t be used on kids.

  33. avatar chuck (hates nj) says:

    Hmm if they ditched the pepper spray for fireball, have it blast club music and text all of your contacts something along the lines of “turn down for what” with the photo it took of said party goer being hosed down with fireball I would think they would have a hit product here.

  34. avatar Indiana Tom says:

    Another deadly gimmick.

  35. avatar J says:

    I’m sure I can make one these with a cardboard tube and duct tape. But isn’t it a bad idea to make something look like a gun when it isn’t?

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