Israel Exporting Ammo to Federal as U.S. Releases Ammo to Israel

(courtesy federalpremium.com)

You may recall that America released ammunition supplies to the Israelis during their recent “police action” against Hamas in Gaza. You may be surprised to learn that Israel has been making and exporting ammunition – albeit pistol rounds as opposed to 120-mm and 40-mm rounds – to America for Federal Premium. That’s the revelation unearthed by an investigation into the Israeli-owned shipping company Zim, the target of recent port blockades organized by Palestinian solidarity activists in California (don’t ask). According to truth-out.org . . .

on August 15, just a few days before the blockade of the Zim Piraeus in Oakland, the Zim Constanza arrived at the Port of Savannah, along the Atlantic coast of Georgia, laden with millions of rounds of Israeli-manufactured 5.56-millimeter rifle bullets destined for sale in the United States. Records show that the Zim Constanza was also carrying 1.3 million rounds of 9-millimeter Luger bullets.The ammunition was destined for Federal Cartridge of Anoka, Minnesota. The company (which also operates under the name Federal Premium Ammunition) sells rounds of these exact specifications to the public, but also to the US military, and federal and local police agencies . . .

Bills of lading for the August 15 small arms shipment delivered by Zim show that the bullets were manufactured by Israel Military Industries Ltd., a weapons manufacturing company located in the city of Ramat Hasharon, north of Tel Aviv in Israel. Israel Military Industries supplies the Israel Defense Forces with many of its weapons, including missiles and artillery. Records show that the Israeli ammunition carried by Zim is being imported primarily by Federal Cartridge, but that several smaller companies in Tennessee and Washington State are also receiving small arms shipments delivered by Zim ships.

A year’s worth of data reveals that a prolific quantity of ammunition manufactured by Israel Military Industries is being imported by Federal Cartridge on Zim ships into the United States. Several Zim vessels made at least 17 different trips between Haifa, Israel and the Port of Savannah over the last year, shipping ammunition for delivery to Federal Cartridge’s facilities in Minnesota. Most of the ammunition consisted of 5.56-millimeter rifle bullets, but in July, the Zim Tarragona arrived at the Port of Savannah carrying 20 pallets, or 1.3 million rounds, of 9-millimeter hollow point bullets. Hollow point rounds expand on contact with human flesh and do greater damage than most other types of ammunition.

Yes, well, anti-hollow point agitprop aside, I hope TTAG’s Armed Intelligentsia will absorb this information and favor Federal in its ammunition selection process. YPMV (Your Politics May Vary).

comments

  1. avatar jwm says:

    Don’t have a 5.56 chambered weapon but I and a bunch of others in my circle have 9’s. Will look for the brand to buy. Admired the IDF since 73. Even if they looked like they dressed out of a yard sale.

    I think the term was “Sabra”, could be wrong about that. Military aged Israeli girls in real short shorts and uzi’s. Quite a mix.

    1. avatar Chris (not one of the other 2 chris's) says:

      mmm, Hummus.

      On a serious note, the term “Sabra” typically applies to Jews born in historical Palestine.

  2. avatar Tom in Oregon says:

    Wideners has been selling IMI stuff for quite some time
    Prices aren’t bad if you have a license and account through them.

    https://www.wideners.com

    1. avatar Sixpack70 says:

      I get Widener’s weekly emails and it has a lot of IWI ammo. I have enough ammo currently to tide me over while I buy other accessories. After that, I will need more ammo!

    2. avatar jjKayd says:

      I think Widener’s should update their website. I’ve been thinking that for a while and this seems like an appropriate time to share my opinion.

  3. avatar wrc says:

    IMI used to underpin the Winchester brand. For example: Q3131A, back in the day, under contract to Olin.

    Ammunition, to spec, is a commodity. Other than the “Hate Israel Now” cadres, what’s the issue?

    1. avatar Jus Bill says:

      “Offshoring” manufacturing jobs (and income) that are needed in CONUS, for one thing.

      Then there’s always the dependence on foreign sources. Remember the oil crises when the Middle East got mad at us?

  4. avatar Roy says:

    Federal just lost my business.

    1. avatar Wood says:

      Why? IMI is good stuff, from a shooter/reloader perspective. And Israel is our only stable/reliable ally over there. Or at least before the current Oval Office squatter dropped the ball at our end.

      1. avatar Roy says:

        Because I will not financially support a company that exists largely for the benefit of the Israeli army. I do not support the murder of Palestinians, or the occupation of Palestine.

        1. avatar S.CROCK says:

          “or the occupation of Palestine”

          Ummm Palestine is the one occupying the Jewish temple.

          As for the murdering of Palestinians, well it sucks that they use their citizens a human shields but you can’t just sit back and get bombarded with rockets and do nothing.

        2. avatar The Brotherhood of Steel says:

          Well, if your bothered by the murder of innocents, don’t even bother buying ammo at all then. Because ammo from Russia, the eastern bloc, east asia, and just about every American ammo manufacturer that’s exported ammo or sold to the US military has been used to kill innocent people. Its called war, not paintball or laser tag. Don’t like it? tough, sell all your guns and don’t buy anything else ever either because just about everything not firearms related is made or supported by slavery at some point. The world sucks.

        3. avatar Forrest says:

          Just as you have a God given right to defend yourself, Israel has a God given right to defend itself. They have been the victims of suicide attacks, kidnappings, and rocket attacks from Hamas and Palestinian militants and they fought back. There’s more than just a little evidence that those attacks often originated from within civilian populations, hospitals, schools, and even UN buildings.

          Why should you enjoy the right to self defense but not an entire nation built on the rubble of the Hollocaust, surrounded on all sides by enemies who call for their genocide, and constantly attacked by terrorists within their borders.

          Look up Israeli expansion. You won’t find a whole lot. They won every war they ever fought, yet gave land to others after each victory. They fought off destruction only to give a home to the Palestinians who had been kicked out of their homes in Egypt.

          I don’t really expect to change your mind, it sounds as if it’s made up; but that doesn’t mean that it’s correct. Yeah, Israel is heavy handed when defending themselves, but I would be too if my neighbors all tried to kill me daily and murdered my children at every opportunity.

        4. avatar juliesa says:

          Anti-semites hold Israel to a standard required of no other country on earth. Anti-semites think Israelis have no right to self defense.

        5. avatar Dave says:

          Got it all figured out hugh bud?

        6. avatar Garrison Hall says:

          I will patronize Federal ammo specifically *because* it is purchasing munitions from from the Israeli military (and the state of Israel). Those “innocents” lost their land in a series of ill-advised wars which were intended to drive Jews from *their* ancestral land. Make no mistake, Jews took back their land and established a modern state. It’s theirs by right of conquest. And, yes, I’ve read the history. All of it.

        7. avatar Powerwiz says:

          Good more Federal rounds for me. I would stack the Palestinians like cords of wood if given the opportunity.

          Go Israel!!!

        8. avatar pwrserge says:

          Palestine is a work of fiction. It has never existed as a sovereign nation in modern history. You can’t “occupy” a place that never existed. As for “murdering” palestinians… Maybe is Hamas would quit using civilians as human shields, fewer civilians would get killed when the IDF comes over to take out the trash.

        9. avatar morethantwobraincells says:

          You are a simplistic trendwhore. You know nothing about the history of Israel. Your ignorance could fill a fleet of Palestinian ambulances, if they weren’t already filled with ordnance targeted at Israeli civilians.
          And save your pathetic “Israel kills civilians too” screed, because it’s B.S.
          Israel targets Hamas fighters and balances the number of enemy casualties against the severity of civilian casualties. If too many civilians are in danger of harm, the strike won’t happen.
          Does Hamas do that? In a way, yes. They assess how many innocent civilians will be hurt in an attack, and if it isn’t ENOUGH, the attack just gets BIGGER.
          I LOATH idiots like you. Weak, quisling, spineless fools such as yourself are the only reason terrorism still exists. Without your instinctual “Surrender When Scared” reflex, the world would have already invalidated the idea of terrorism through swift and lethal military action. Instead, we have a never-ending parade of horrors inflicted on innocent people, while fools such as yourself attempt to appease terrorists with a delicate balance of apology and indecisive, ineffective military action.
          That’s why you hate Israel. Israel doesn’t play the liberal game. Israel doesn’t allow terrorism to work.
          Federal doesn’t want your business. NERF doesn’t even want your business. You belong on the other side. Do us all a favor and go there.

        10. avatar Joe Wright says:

          There is no Palestine ! It is an area made up by the British .

        11. avatar Jeff says:

          I guess you had better stop paying your taxes then, since the US gives billions in foreign aid to both Israel and Palestine.

        12. avatar wantmycountryback says:

          Israel being the poor kid who just wants to get along in a bad neighborhood Is just Jew propaganda, don’t believe everything you see on main stream media news, its owned by Jews.

          A large portion of Palestinians are Christian!!!

        13. avatar LarryinTX says:

          A large portion of Palestinians are Christian!!!

          Who cares?

        14. avatar Paco says:

          Roy, be careful here, this place is a politically correct, Zionist, fox-news fanboy club. The Israeli propaganda is thicker than oil here.

        15. avatar DBM says:

          PACO,
          A large part of our military aide to Israel money goes to buy ammo from IDI. We buy somewhere between 10-15% of our rifle ammo and about 100% of 9mm. Keeps the production lines running and a huge supply of ammo for the IDF is they need it.

        16. avatar nahraf says:

          Agreed. Federal also lost my business. I also do not support the constant murder of Palestinian children and the theft of land.

        17. My guess is you are an athiest, and you’ve never read the Bible. On my honor this is not a sarcastic comment: I’m truly sorry. Israel is God’s land and we need to support her in every way we can.

      1. avatar rlc2 says:

        heh, thanks thats a keeper. maybe an avatar if I can shrink it far enough…

        1. avatar JohnO says:

          Download Irfanview ( http://www.irfanview.com/ ). It’s a really good free graphics tool. Download the plugins, too.

        2. avatar rlc2 says:

          JohnO- thanks good tip.

    2. avatar Jug says:

      Federal just lost your business?

      That is nothing but short sightedness, (and that is being far too kind), to such an ignorant statement!

    3. avatar rlc2 says:

      Hey, no problem, more for me.
      Federal is already my #1 go to for best value for price, and
      its the best range ammo in the One Gun To Rule Them All (G23).

      Now, if we can only encourage truthout.org to get all the progtards to boycott some .22LR makers…

      Ok, I know, that its a faint hope, an oxymoron = progtard shooters,
      but you never know- just a few more nitwit Presbyterians deciding to divest their ammo selections,
      along with the Synods latest BDS policy, and you never know….

      PS: as a public service, I am willing to pay shipping to all Progtards*
      needing to divest themselves of Federal in .22LR. Any .22Lr, for that matter.

      Disclaimer- obviously, I wouldnt insult you by offering to pay you for the demonic ammo,
      as I am sure it would be ungodly for you to take money for something so tainted by the Tribe.

      Hell, for a large enough quantity, I will come get it in person.
      Anything not to have to hang around Walmart loading docks at 4 AM..

      *(Presbyterians, White Supremacy, ZOG, KKK and various other anti-semite fan boys, included in this offer,
      as I am interdenominational in my search for demon ammo, no need to thank me)

      1. avatar jwm says:

        What the phuck is a ZOG, over?

        1. avatar CentralIL says:

          Don’t ask…

    4. avatar jwm says:

      Roy, in case it slipped your notice, Robert Farago is a Jew. You’re kinda supporting him by posting here. Now back to the trailer park with you.

      1. avatar rlc2 says:

        Also a hypnotist, so be careful he doesn’t have you barking at the moon, there Roy, by remote control.

        1. avatar Kris says:

          But of course, all Zionists practice mind control. /sarc

        2. avatar Paul53 says:

          Since Robert sent some hearing protection I won on TTAG, my GF has been claiming I cluck like a chicken in my sleep. I offered to see a doctor. She objected saying she liked the eggs, whatever that means. Thanks Robert, miss the hot IDF chic pics.

    5. avatar Longfisher says:

      Agreed.

      There’s really only one word one must know in order to form a rational and moral position on Israel and the Palestinians; Nakba.

      All else that followed the Nakba was/is a product of that original sin, resistance to that original sin or propaganda or overt political bribery used to make the U.S., in general, and the the hyper-religious U.S. Christians (the end-timers) and Congress disregard of the original sin.

      But history has a long memory.

      LF

      LF

  5. avatar Scrubula says:

    That’s cool. I wish they were a bit more open about it. Who knows. Maybe it’s just coincidence that it isn’t common knowledge.

  6. avatar Mad Cow says:

    IMI makes good stuff. Their Independence 5.56 was the only thing you could occasionally find for a while post Sandy Hook. This importation has been going on for, quite literally, years….maybe even decades. And blockades aside, will continue to happen, and I think we’re better off for it.

    I just have to keep on saving up for my Tavor.

    1. avatar Anon in CT says:

      I seem to recall that when things were really heating up in Iraq, the Israelis were shipping ammor directly to US troops in the theatre. Because that’s what friends do.

      Of course, that does make we wonder just how low US and NATO war stocks have fallen. I suppose it’s good that there’s such a good civvie market for 5.56, 9mm and 7.62, since in a pinch Uncle Sugar can just grab everything coming off the line.

      1. avatar Jus Bill says:

        Not if the line is on the other side of the world and the shipping lanes are at risk. We need to rebuild US manufacturing capability again. But you are beginning to get the idea anyway.

    2. avatar Kris says:

      When the panic was at it’s peak in 2013 and 30-round AR mags were going for $50, the Mako Group (www.themakogroup.com) was importing E-lander mags from Isreal by the boatload twice a week. LITERALLY. Selling for $17 a piece. Mako doubled their staff and worked around the clock 7 days a week to get orders shipped. It took about 6 weeks to get your order but they guaranteed you’d get your order. When legislation was proposed to ban standard cap mags produced before a certain date, Mako immediately started stamping dates on the mags. Within a few weeks, started engraving dates into the metal. The Isreali E-lander mags are the nicest steel AR mags I have.

      The Mako Group and IMI are unsung heros. They pulled out all the stops to do everything possible to support American gun owners when things were bleak. Pooled all available resources and DIDNT EVEN INCREASE THEIR PRICES.

  7. avatar angryAZ says:

    Federal just gained a whole bunch of business

  8. avatar Ralph says:

    So we send them heavy stuff and they send us rifle and pistol ammo that civilians might actually be able to buy? I’m good with that. In fact, I think it’s ironic and kind of fitting that Joe Jihad might get scragged right here in the good ol’ USA by ammo made in Israel.

    1. avatar rlc2 says:

      Waiting for the porcine lube packed bullets.
      I hear its better than CLP and any 22Lr used actually makes your rifle cleaner.

      Its the next Zombie Green. You heard it here first.

    2. avatar Mark N. says:

      They recycle the brass from the artillery rounds. Plenty of them just laying around.

      1. avatar 277Volt says:

        My favorite blades for my Merkur 37C are Crystals made in Israel. I always joke they’re made of the finest knocked out Syrian armor.

    3. avatar Kris says:

      Yup. Ralph wins the internets again.

    4. avatar Jus Bill says:

      Ralph, you just made me smile.

  9. avatar Indiana Tom says:

    Israel needs to make .22lr ammo.

  10. avatar My Older Brother Chet says:

    ” hollow point rounds expands on contact with human skin” . How the hell am I supposed to load them?

    1. avatar jwm says:

      Gloves. Don’t you know that all operators operating operationally have really operational gloves on? Operator, please.

      1. avatar 277Volt says:

        Gotta have the gloves. I hate it when those XTP’s go all ‘Jiffy Pop’ on me.

    2. avatar Marcus Aurelius Payne says:

      Chopsticks

    3. avatar lefty jason says:

      that is amazing. somebody along the lines of my sense of humor.

  11. avatar TiC says:

    Is this the same Israeli made “Independence” garbage that Federal has been selling? I wouldn’t put that dirty crap in Mini 14.

    That filthy ammo is the only thing that’s ever caused a failure in my BCM AR. I couldn’t believe how dirty it was after just 200 rounds of that crap. It’s worse than Tula.

    1. avatar Accur81 says:

      I’ll take every round from you, then. Wouldn’t want your gun to get dirty.

      1. avatar TiC says:

        Never bought any more after that first batch. I don’t mind dirty, but this junk caused a failure in a rifle that has never failed with anything else.

        If you’re willing to trust that kind of garbage, enjoy.

  12. avatar DrewR55 says:

    I’m good with this. I like Federal and I like Israel so I’ll keep giving them my dollars.

  13. avatar The Brotherhood of Steel says:

    “Zim Constanza arrived at the Port of Savannah, along the Atlantic coast of Georgia, laden with millions of rounds of Israeli-manufactured 5.56-millimeter rifle bullets destined for sale in the United States”

    Damn that ship passed right by my house! Wish they woulda “dropped” a few off for me hahaha.

    Good luck getting some sort of libturd protest going in Georgia. I supposed they could get a few northern hipsters together.

    1. avatar jwm says:

      Zodiac.

      1. avatar The Brotherhood of Steel says:

        Ah yes! that would’ve been a great idea!

        1. avatar LarryinTX says:

          Does it count as terrorism if a bunch of us get together, don blackface and zodiac out to a ship at midnight to liberate a pallet or two?

        2. avatar jwm says:

          Do you really want to try and pirate an Israeli ammo ship at midnight? Might get the ammo at 750 rpm.

    2. avatar juliesa says:

      The west coast union strikes and prog blockaders are driving more shipping through the Panama canal to the Gulf. As a citizen of a GoM state, that’s good with me.

  14. avatar Avid Reader says:

    If they only made .22 LR. . .

  15. avatar DBM says:

    Israel has 6 months combat reserve ammo in storage. They don’t need the 5.56 and the ammo that is ours is in storage at the Israeli arms storage depot. They have access to it at all times. It was just a political show to fors BO to appear to support Israel.

  16. avatar Dermott says:

    Hey Roy,
    I’ll be buying your share. I guess you do support the murder of Jews though. I’m not Jewish. The “Palestinians” have no problem in shooting rockets into school children’s playgrounds and shooting them from schools etc. The Israeli’s are only protecting themselves.

    GFY

    IN CASE YOU DONT KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS “Go f#%k yourself”.

    1. avatar Dave says:

      Big freaking plus one.

  17. avatar Tom says:

    I wish that they would bring back the Israeli made 7.62×39 ammo. It was match grade stuff. Any of the Israeli ammo is excellent quality.

  18. avatar rt-texas says:

    All the more reason to add to my ammo fort. I have plenty of Fed stashed and now will add more.

    Besides, my Tavor loves home cooking.

    Thank you

    1. avatar Timmy! says:

      Wait, weren’t OUR Tavors made in Pennsylvania?

  19. avatar CentralIL says:

    My first case of 45 ACP (for my first pistol) when I was a teen back in the late 90s was IMI. Great stuff. Many fond memories.

    $0.23 per round of brass cased FMJ is also a fond memory. Have to cast my own now.

  20. avatar Phil says:

    Why anyone should favor a foreign interest whatsoever? Is that so hard to favor an American company for American interests when it comes down to ammo or gun selection?

    Also, the whole “Israel has the right to defend itself” thing is quite ridiculous. Of course any country has the right to defend itself, but it might be good to look at the situation. In one side, you have the IDF, one of the most powerful military force in the middle-east, with nuclear capabilities, modern weapons and support of the most powerful military forces in the world (the US) and NATO support… In the other hand, a concentration camp with a bunch of terrorists using 40+ years old weapons… still deadly enough, but definitely not in the same league as the IDF, the US or NATO. So at this point, it’s not about “defending” when you’re in a leading position.

    And regarding the whole “return to land” thing… Well if we follow this logic that Jews could go back in Palestine territories because it’s said it was their 2,000 years ago; and if we agree with that, it would mean we would agree for the Brits, French or Mexicans to come back in the US to get their land back because it was also theirs once by the past? What about Native Americans then? And Americans would have nothing to say, nothing to do to resist? To me… I don’t think so!

    But yes, Israel has the right to have its land (for the exact same reasons), and it was pretty well defined in ’67. Yes, everything needs to be done to stop terrorists from all around the world (from Palestine, to Irak, to Afghanistan, to Washington D.C…. oops!), but when there’s a force ratio, we always have to be very very careful, because it’s the one with the most powerful military force that will always be considered as the “aggressor”. That’s the reason why the US are considered as the aggressor in so many wars, regardless what really happen during those wars. Some of you might think it’s B.S. (and you might even be right) but that’s pretty much the way it is and how it appears.

    If you’re my neighbor next door and you’re throwing plastic darts to me over the fence… and in my backyard I have 10 of my friends with their AR-15 to respond back to you, how fair would it be and how long could we consider that as “self-defense”? Could it last over 60 years? To me… I don’t think so. It looks just pretty convenient.

    1. avatar pwrserge says:

      Actually the IDF is very surgical in their strikes. Overwhelming, yes, but surgical. It just so happens that Hamas uses women and children as ablative armor for their rocket installation. In your neighbor example, he would be throwing WWI era grenades and sporting his baby body armor. The grenades might have a 1 in 100 chance of actually doing something… But do you honestly expect proportional response to blatant terror attacks on civilian targets?

      1. avatar Phil says:

        There’s nothing “surgical” in war.

        And if you have one of your neighbors (let say we don’t know which one to be more realistic) that throws a WWII grenade… and you can have a 500 men SWAT team around each house, A-10s & drones in the sky, snipers, heavy laser guided rockets and the whole nine yards military force the IDF, US and NATO combined could have… Do you really think your terrorist neighbor would survive over 60 years?

        This has nothing to do with being proportional.

        1. avatar Sixpack70 says:

          Or they can decide not to toss the grenade and get the 500 man SWAT team after them. It’s really easy to not get attacked by Israel. Just don’t attack them first.

        2. avatar Full Cleveland says:

          Probably not.

    2. avatar morethantwobraincells says:

      Dude…
      “Plastic darts”?
      Let’s be a little more realistic about what Hamas is doing.
      If I snuck into your yard, booby-trapped your lawnmower with C4, slit your dogs throat, abducted your children and set fire to your house, you’d feel like getting your friends together and getting me off your back, right?
      “Plastic darts…”
      Some people are totally blind to reality.

      1. avatar Phil says:

        Yes, it’s called analogy.
        A plastic dart to an AR-15… like a C4 or AK47 to a Nuclear capable force.

        1. avatar morethantwobraincells says:

          Really? Because Israel has nukes they should allow themselves to be destroyed?
          America is nuclear-capable. Should we tolerate 9/11-style attacks because they aren’t nuclear?
          Should a police officer accept knife wounds because they aren’t from a firearm?
          This isn’t a trading card game, where a +5 Airstrike card always beats a +1 Suicide Bomber card.
          Your worldview seems to be distilled from the old-style Western, in which the hero gallantly tosses his gun away and uses his fists when the bad guy runs out of ammunition.
          Never buy Federal ammo again. It’s already hard to find, and I want more.

      2. avatar Phil says:

        There’s nothing gallant in my worldview. My idea is that when your opponent gets out of ammo, you shoot and put him down. But then you don’t wait for him to get back after month of recovery to shoot him back again. You get him in jail and then you’re make sure to occupy the territory to not have his brother or cousin to come back to shoot at you.

        This is what happens with the UN Peacekeeping operations. Will you tell me than few terrorist in shitholes in the middle-east could be stronger than the whole IDF, US, NATO and UN forces combined? Seriously??

    3. avatar Hack says:

      You’re right, Hamas’ rockets and, recently, their GPS – guided mortars (supplied by Russia) are a lot like plastic darts.

      And all those tunnels going into Israel were dug so they could surprise some Israeli civilians with a coke and a smile.

      1. avatar Phil says:

        You don’t get the whole concept of “Analogy”, do you?

    4. avatar The Brotherhood of Steel says:

      Right, the Palestinians are the underdogs so Israel is not defending itself. Wow, you’ve certainly drank the libturd Koolaid. Dumbest logic I’ve seen on here. Go on keep explaining yourself you look like a total weasel.

    5. avatar Lemming says:

      Okay, so if someone poor tries to rob me, and hit me with a baseball bat, using a gun _isn’t_ self-defense because… reasons?

      1. avatar Phil says:

        Because it’s not self-defense if he’s lying already in the ground and you shoot him 30 times in his back with a large caliber… no, in that case it’s not self-defense… It’s sel-defense when it comes to you to aggress you and you shoot him until he’s down or you stop him.

        What if you shoot him, he’s down, then you wait he recovers and after few weeks, just before he gets up again, you shoot him again in the back… Is that self-defense? Personally, I don’t think so…

        You brutally shoot him, stop him, and call police (such US, NATO, etc…) and you get him in jail and then you don’t have to deal with it anymore.

        I know very bad analogy, but hopefully you’ll get my point.

    6. avatar LarryinTX says:

      In one side, you have the IDF, one of the most powerful military force in the middle-east, with nuclear capabilities, modern weapons and support of the most powerful military forces in the world (the US) and NATO support… In the other hand, a concentration camp with a bunch of terrorists using 40+ years old weapons… still deadly enough, but definitely not in the same league as the IDF, the US or NATO. So at this point, it’s not about “defending” when you’re in a leading position.

      While I agree about the difference in capabilities, all that shows is the inherent insanity of groups like Hamas, continuing to attack Israel with the stated goal of killing all jews, followed by killing all Americans, then someone else, I am sure. All they exist for is to kill. Israel seems to be building and expanding their economy, Hamas seems to be killing indiscriminately. When you are attacked, your response is called a defense. What you clearly want is for Israel to just ignore the attacks, allow those hateful morons to continue attacking them without paying any cost. A seriously stupid idea.

      1. avatar Phil says:

        I haven’t said that Larry.

        I said, with the power the IDF has, including US and NATO forces, they could be done already and it would not take 60 years. Let’s take an explain (a pretty recent one). Ferguson, MO. There’s criminals that use this event to destroy everything they want… pretty much like terrorists, right?

        What is the reaction when people see militarised police? Some think it’s justify because we can’t leave this kind of disorder… But in the other hand, some people think the whole force is over the top. So, what would we think if the whole Ferguson, MO thing would continue now for months and months and even years? (Yeah, some would think it’s pretty much like Chicago).

        Now, let’s see another point of view… Let’s say the whole Ferguson, MO thing is spreading all around the US. And then the dear King leader Obama ask help from NATO or even China to keep peace in the US. So what we would considered as “foreigner forces” would come in the US and occupy US soil. How would you react? Would you just stay passive or would you fight? You would probably go to Ferguson, MO by yourself to fight the local “terrorists”… But how would you feel if the foreign forces would still be there 60 years later and would potentially consider any Americans as a potential threat? And for that matter, they would remove any access to ressources, no freedom to travel, to bear arms, to build houses, access to water, etc… Would you just stay passive or would you fight?

        I know, I know… the whole middle-east thing is way more complex than that. I’m not saying it’s an “easy” task for Israel, I’m just saying sometimes it’s pretty convenient to keep a war going… History did prove it several times already.

  21. avatar CentralIL says:

    Speaking of Israel, how are Tavor sales now? Has coverage of the conflict increased consumer interest?

    1. avatar Timmy! says:

      Judging from the way prices are “dropping,” I’d say sales are “not brisk.”

      I see them at the gun shows for $300.00 to $400.00 LESS than I paid last year… when I see them at all that is.

      But that may just be here in The Metroplex, YMMV.

  22. avatar Jjmmyjonga says:

    Federal .22lr sucks, but most everything else is good, including Lake City. I am happy to buy any of their products.
    I like the USA, and hold its interests above any other countries, wherever those interests lie, so As far as as non gun- related banter “My god is better than yours, allah aker bla bla bla, god given right, holy land, club catholic vs protestant vs jew vs muslim vs hindu vs … my club is better than your club and I prefer to wok with my club, and as the world turns.”

  23. avatar Tom Jefferson says:

    Am I reading this right? They are SELLING their ammo to us, while we’re GIVING our ammo to them? Is this right? Wow, no wonder the feds have us 17.5 Trillion in the hole with deals like that!
    As for all this “nobody wants Israel to exist” stuff, all I’ve got to say is this; If Israel can make it and strive, thrive and survive, I say more power to ’em! They’re tough bastards, and have made a tough Country that has no problem standing up and duking it out with all comers; but it’s time for America to cut them loose economically. We simply cannot afford to keep backing them to the tune of hundreds of millions, if not billions of dollars per year that has to be borrowed from China by our “leaders” and then charged to the American citizen’s ticket. That shit’s got to stop! Not only for Israel, but for the rest of the world as well. Hell, the national symbol for America shouldn’t be an eagle, it should be a milk cow with flaming red teats that are damn near so sore they’re almost falling off from so many sucking on ’em. Our politicians, and the rest of the world just hasn’t got the message yet, but the cow’s dry! The milk’s gone! The days of America as milk cow to the world are at an end, and the sooner everybody realizes it, the better! Maybe when the politicians find out they can’t borrow another dime, or tax us one more percent, then, hopefully, we’ll relearn how to mind our own business and let other people around the world mind theirs. I think we’ll find that, once we get our size 12 boot out of everybody’s asses, and our huge honkin’ nose out of their business, they’ll quit trying to blow our shit up and go back to blowing each others shit up and leave us alone.

    1. avatar Full Cleveland says:

      Historically wrong. Muslim’s want us to convert or die regardless of our relationship with Israel. I look at Israel and Palestine and see one country that is industrious, educated, focused on meeting world markets by developing technology and protects its people. I see another that is solely committed to annihilating everyone and everything that is not part of their culture. As far as economics go the whole thing is a concept. There is as much money as there is. The US and the world does not operate on a checkbook. If it did we never would have recovered from the Great Depression or fought WWII or built interstates or started NASA or become a worldwide military force that champions human rights. The world today is not perferct but it is as good as good people have been able to make it. The “debt” reflects accounting for costs to achieve this but it doesn’t matter if the debt is lots more or less because in reality it is conceptual and neither can nor will ever be paid. Think of it this way; tomorrow the debt could be conceptualized differently and brought to zero or we could have a limitless surplus and nothing would change. Well that’s overstated. Actually only conceptualized values would change. Things like stock markets and currencies but (spoiler alert for preppers) things would return to normal fairly quickly. Ford Motor Company would still be Ford Motor Company and the new financial base would still be founded on US currency because there isn’t anything that comes close to the US for power and stability although we have lost leadership. Additionally our world view accommodates everyone including those who would destroy us. So keep your personal finances shipshape but don’t worry about national and international debt. That game is played by only a select few.

      1. avatar LarryinTX says:

        I have no objection to eliminating Israel’s US subsidies, but only after a couple of years have gone by since we cut to zero all other foreign aid including to the Palestinians!

      2. avatar Phil says:

        Just a little note:

        Muslims, by their religious laws, don’t force anyone to convert or die, this is not in the Quran and not the final goal in Islamic Eschatology. This is an ideology used by extremist terrorists that aren’t even real good muslims. Just like some ideologies that were used in the name of the bible by the KKK or some sectarian evil groups…

        For everything else you said, I agree 110%

      3. avatar Tom Jefferson says:

        Wow, your rebuttal is so….incredibly wrong in so many ways, I can see that I have no hope of removing enough of the garbage, (that you obviously deem to be valued knowledge), in order to get to the still functioning parts of your brain so that I may correct the litany of egregious errors you’ve put forth in, what I can only term as your “acid trip understanding” of the mechanics of economics……Your twisted thoughts on the Muslim religion alone would take several hours to rectify in and of itself; to say nothing of your ideas on economics and commerce in general. I really would, though, like to be a fly on the wall if you ever try to use your “debt is only a concept” theory when it comes time for you to make your car payment. I would be horse laughing as you run after the wrecker the repo men are using to haul your car away because you tried to enlightened your loan officer to the fact that, “debt is only a concept,” instead of paying what you owe.
        Please, do me a favor, if you still have any functioning brain cells, read Henry Hazlitt’s “Economics in One Lesson,” and Peter Schiff’s “How and Economy Grows and Why It Crashes.” If, by sheer chance, you’ve been able to fathom and digest these, then, just perhaps, you may be able to handle some more substantial fare. If so, I suggest you read “Anatomy of the State” by Murray Rothbard and “Liberty and Property” by Ludwig Von Mises. Also, if you really want to learn how the US came out of WWII, then read “The Private Production of Defense” by Hans-Hermann Hoppe.
        I hold no illusions that you will ever attempt to dredge your mind out of the thick ooze of public school Keynesianism in which it is so solidly mired; but, if you do, and actually want to understand the unabashed truth of how an economy actually works, then avail yourself of the above titles and study them. The truth will set you free!
        Oh, and one more thing, please, do let me know if you ever try to “conceptualize” any of your outstanding debt, I would absolutely love to be there!

        1. avatar DBM says:

          Apparently you are incapable of reading history or even see how islam has been practiced worldwide since the time of Mohammed. I have been to the middle east many times over the last 30 years and have seen how it its practiced. You can take your islam is a religion of peace love and happiness and shove it up your posterior because what you say as a lie.

  24. avatar Accur81 says:

    I’ve got a bunch of Federal 5.56, and will be getting a more. I’m particularly fond of the HST as well. My Federal buckshot also groups pretty tight.

    It’s a shame I also like Hornady and Wilson Combat ammo so much (particularly for the 6.8), because now my check book is really in trouble.

  25. avatar TheYetti says:

    So I suppose if I’m buying Federal Premium then I’m supporting Israel? I’ll go buy a box on my way home then.

  26. avatar Mike in NC says:

    Just a reminder that domestic ammo production pre-SHTF (Sandy Hook Total Freakout) was around 12 billion rounds per year which works out to about 120 rounds per firearm owner. Even if manufacturers could double production we would still need boat-loads of imported rounds to meet current demands.

    Sadly, the shipment destined for Savannah was only 20 pallets (a single container?). I’ve been buying the Federal Premium 9mm for years.

    On a side note, just yesterday I noticed boxes of Federal ALUMINUM cased 9mm at Wal-Mart. I much prefer brass and hope there isn’t a brass shortage looming.

  27. avatar Old Air Force says:

    I for one am happy with the IMI 5.56 I have used. It is not stamped NATO but it shoots well and is mostly consistent. It make great range ammo. I reload for my accuracy rounds anyway. I have not tried their .40 yet but plan to. I do not have a problem helping out the IMF or Israel. As a christian I view them as my brothers. Here in Texas their IMI ammo is readily available in 5.56 and is generally less costly than most of the others, including Tula. My take, the ammo is good and not from China so I will use it.

  28. avatar jimmyjames says:

    That would be funny if inside the American Eagle boxes it said made in Israel. I had a case of that WW Q ball 556 ammo that said exactly that.

  29. avatar Paelorian says:

    All else being equal, if one of two boxes of ammo pisses off ignorant anti-gun, anti-hollow point/pro-overpenetration, probably terrorism-apologist “Palestinian solidarity activists” I’ll happily buy that one. Those people do not share my values.

  30. avatar JKP says:

    Well, it figures that the truthout.org people would feel comfortable in boycotting Federal Premium. They’re a bunch of commies over there, so they wouldn’t even use 5.56/.223. Plus, they probably reload anyway.

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