Daily Digest: Pocket Carry Sans Holster Edition

Boston Mayor Marty Walsh courtesy boston.cbslocal.com

In the wake of the accidental shooting of a 9-year-old by his 14-year-old brother last Friday, Boston is planning to start a gun buy-up program. [ChiTrib scrubbed original story, so that’s a cached copy. The internet never forgets.] The new initiative was announced Saturday by Mayor Marty Walsh (above), who took office last month, and joined MAIG last week. “It’s a short-term solution. We need help from the community, we need help from these people to let us know where these guns are, who has these guns, so we can get them off the street,” said Walsh. “We also know that buy-ups . . .

let us look like we’re doing something productive, and are great press.” OK, he didn’t say that last part, but despite all the fanfare, critics say that buy-ups have no discernible impact on crime rates. Police Commissioner William B. Evans said the buy-up will only be a part of the overall gun strategy. Other facets include an anonymous tip line for people to report guns (See Something, Say Something), and plans for installing kiosks at police stations, where residents can drop off weapons, no questions asked. I am not making that up.

Surprising no one, a pair of Republican backed bills to repeal the high-capacity magazine sales ban in Colorado failed last week. Democrats control both chambers of the Colorado legislature meaning they also hold majorities on all the committees. The House bill was rejected by committee Monday on a 7-4 party-line vote. The Senate bill, which had identical language to the House bill, was “postponed indefinitely” on Wednesday, also in a 3-2 party-line vote. As noted, this came as no surprise, but the gun rights side sees it as a necessary step, and valuable ammunition for use in the upcoming election cycle.

A domestic violence-related gun control bill passed out of the Washington state House this week. HB 1840 would require some gun owners with a restraining or protective order against them to temporarily surrender their firearms while the order is in effect. This bill died in the state Senate last year, but the revised version passed the House 97-0 this week after compromise language was added that adds more judicial oversight. The new language prevents the surrender of guns unless the order is accompanied by an additional finding that the subject constitutes a “credible threat.” Unlike last year, the new version with the new language is supported by the NRA as a way to protect domestic violence victims.

A 46-year-old Hanover, Maryland man is in hot water after threatening a 21-year-old woman and her dog with a handgun Saturday night. The woman was walking her dog and came across the man, who was also walking his dog. As she approached, she saw him pointing the gun at her dog and in her general direction. They exchanged brief words and left the area. Police later located a man matching the victim’s description, and he was found to have a loaded, unfired Ruger .22 caliber handgun and a set of nunchucks. Police said he faces charges of first- and second-degree assault, reckless endangerment and “several handgun charges.”

An off-duty Miami-Dade corrections officer experienced a negligent discharge outside a Fort Lauderdale restaurant Saturday night. He was reaching into his pocket for a valet ticket when he “accidentally triggered his concealed handgun,” firing a round into the ground and spattering a half-dozen nearby people with shrapnel. To his credit, he immediately called his supervisor and stayed on scene at the restaurant where he was interviewed by Miami-Dade internal affairs. Police deemed the incident accidental.

Here’s Eric from Moss Pawn & Gun with a video comparing the IWI Tavor TAR-21 with an AR-15. Most of you are probably at least passingly familiar with the Tavor, and this puts it side-by-side with the intimately familiar AR platform to give a better frame of reference.

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comments

  1. avatar S.CROCK says:

    this off-duty officer in Miami further proves that the liberals are correct in saying only trained professionals should be able to carry a gun. oh wait no it doesn’t… well then the liberal media will just have to cover up that story.

    1. avatar Dave says:

      From everything I’ve seen, cops hardly qualify as trained professionals…

    2. avatar Old Ben turning in grave says:

      Their spin would be, “See, even trained professionals mess up. If even they have mishaps, there’s no way an average person should be trusted with a gun in public.”

  2. avatar BTinAfghan says:

    yet another police ND, would the same outcome have happened if he were not police? Doubtful

    1. avatar Matt in FL says:

      I know that’s the popular thing to say around here, but it’s actually pretty likely that it would have gone the same way. I regularly read stories of negligent discharges, even ones where someone is injured, where there is no arrest, and the prosecutor declines to pursue it.

      1. avatar Randy Drescher says:

        Thanks, sometimes it’s all too easy to dig the heels in & come out fighting.

      2. avatar Nigil says:

        Those details seem to depend largely on the locale and the public prosecutors’ discretion. It certainly does feel like police get a pass way more often than Average Joe.

        1. avatar Steve E says:

          Ask your self this? If you were involved in an accidental discharge incident would there be a chance that you could be fired from your job? Of course they look out for their own, soldiers do too. Lots of professions do the same. This is just common sense. They are human too, we all make mistakes. Hell doctors kill more people in this country than guns do.

      3. avatar Jonathan -- Houston says:

        Without someone like Lott or Kleck conducting the thorough, professional research, then it really just comes down to a battle of anecdotes.

        We’ve all read of cases where regular Joe’s get busted for ND’s, while others connected, like a LEO or that KY state legislator just last month (who ND’s in the Capitol!), gets off without criminal charges. In Texas, its a crime to discharge a firearm within the city limits of any city with a population greater than 100,000. There are multiple legal defenses against that, obviously. However, “oops!” isn’t one of them. In fact, “oops!” is more like a confession to the crime, rather than a defense against it. That crime is a Class A misdemeanor, which gets you up to a year in jail and/or up to a $4,000 fine. Any license to carry a firearm, whether privately or a professional license, goes bye-bye, too.

        And that’s all just with the ND itself. If anyone’s hurt or there’s substantial property damage, then the fun really starts. Try “Injury to a child”, as happened in a Dallas Walmart last year in a similar ND case. “Criminally negligent homicide”, as happened in Houston last year when two pot smokers were supposedly comparing guns and one’s ND killed the other.

        You learn the rules, you follow the rules. You break the law, you pay the price. Prosecutorial discretion that lets anyone off the hook for reckless, deadly conduct, whether for slaves or our government masters, is itself a danger to the public. The good thing is there’s still the civil court system. As for the half dozen shrapnel-spattered victims in this case, let the lawsuits begin!

      4. avatar Ardent says:

        The voice of reason! Thank you Matt.

        NDs that aren’t a result of some very stupid (criminally negligent) activity that occur outside of a few jurisdictions in which prosecutors have a political ax to grind vis a vie anything to do with firearms, and which are not committed by someone already engaged in a criminal activity (felon in possession of firearm, drugs present at scene, wanted person with warrants etc.) are generally chalked up to ‘accidents’ and are seldom prosecuted.
        When Joe Citizen accidentally shoots John Citizen in the basement showing off his latest range toy because he thought it was unloaded, there was no other criminal activity and even the victim doesn’t believe there was any intent or negligence rising to the level of a criminal act and the whole incident is a civil matter it doesn’t make much of a news story, even if this is a much more common model that the sensational stories that do tend to get reported and picked up nationally.

        It’s just more interesting when a cop screws up spectacularly than when a citizen does it. Maybe it’s because in ways we (and the MSM) really do hold them to a higher standard. That’s actually good news to me.

        1. avatar Jonathan - Houston says:

          How negligent must a negligent discharge be before it becomes criminally negligent? Also, how much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?

          Carrying a sidearm in a manner clearly susceptible to unintended discharge is negligence. If not, then when exactly does one cross the magical “very stupid” demarcation?

          Negligence is negligence, and it’s a crime, apparently unless you’re among the ruling class.

        2. avatar Jus Bill says:

          Try damage to property, a wounding, or a killing. YMMV.

  3. avatar Sixpack70 says:

    MA really needs safe storage laws to prevent those accidental shootings from happening! Oh wait, they already do…

    1. avatar Jus Bill says:

      Kiosks in the cop houses = Toyz for Totz

  4. avatar Maineuh says:

    Whenever I read about these negligent discharges, I’m always interested in what kind of gun they were carrying and how it happened. No holster covering the trigger guard? The dreaded Keys in Pocket Syndrome? The press reports almost never relate that part. Figure we might as well learn a little something along with the chance to heckle.

    1. avatar Old Ben turning in grave says:

      Agree. Learning from your own mistakes is good. Learning from other peoples’ mistakes is better.

  5. avatar Hank says:

    “Police deemed the incident accidental.”

    My great-uncle always said, “There are no accidents, only irresponsibilities.” When I was 13 I thought I’d prove him wrong…he just wasn’t.

    1. avatar Soccerchainsaw says:

      When you witness the actions people take in their cars it becomes clear that the news stations could increase their reporting accuracy 50-75% if they stopped calling crashes “accidents” and started calling them “on-purposes”.

  6. avatar nnjj says:

    “Other facets include an anonymous tip line for people to report guns”

    I hope nobody uses this to show statists what it’s like to have the police knock on their door and demand to search the premises for a reported gun.

    1. avatar great unknown says:

      Sure you do…

    2. avatar C says:

      Would be a shame if several boston area newsmen were subject to no knock raids.

      1. I was thinking various liberals who keep guard details…

        1. avatar C says:

          Perish the thought!

  7. avatar Jack Brown says:

    I pocket carry(in a holster). Y’know what else I put in that pocket? NOTHING! The fewer reasons I have to put my hand in that pocket, the better.

    1. avatar Taylor Tx says:

      So Ive NEVER carried a pocket pistol or anything in a pocket holster, so Im curious to ask, does a good holster take up the whole pocket and does it wrap tightly to the gun? It seems that a fair amount of these NDs are due to a bad holster that doesnt adequately the bang switch (but most often attributed to that dastardly ol booger flicker).

      1. avatar peirsonb says:

        Most fully cover the trigger and are shaped to the contour of a pocket to make sure it stays in the same location/orientation. There is one I’ve seen (specifically for the LCR IIRC) that leaves the trigger completely open withe the intent that you draw the whole holster and fire without removing the gun. That one seems loaded with fail, but the others are like any other holster.

        1. avatar RockOnHellChild says:

          A holster with no trigger guard…?

          Might as well save the money and just throw the gun in your pocket, sans holster, go full retard.

    2. avatar int19h says:

      +1.

      I also looked at the available holsters and, after some experimentation, picked the one that was the most rigid (it was one by High Noon). Yes, it prints a little bit more – though with the size of the gun that I carry it’s really not a big deal either way – but it gives me some peace of mind that it won’t dent and catch the trigger.

  8. avatar Russ Bixby says:

    At least he said buy-up instead of buy-back. It’s at least accurate.

    What a turd.

    1. avatar Matt in FL says:

      He didn’t. The last sentence (with buy-ups in it) was me editorializing.

  9. avatar Sam Spade says:

    I pulled a gun on a pit-bull once. He didn’t seem to notice the gun–just kept circling trying to get behind us. His owner came running up, though, and grabbed his dog by the collar. None of us said anything, but the next time I saw him he had his dog on a leash.

  10. avatar Hannibal says:

    “Police later located a man matching the victim’s description, and he was found to have a loaded, unfired Ruger .22 caliber handgun and a set of nunchucks.”

    Mall ninja in training.

    1. avatar 'LilJoe says:

      No, ninja would have light/laser/infrared emitter on the ruger and would only carry the nunchucks attached via a mil-spec picatinny nunchuck mount… Plus real ninjas only carry 50bmg pistols…. In a 3inch barrel… And yes, before you ask the round does protrude past the barrel, that way it doubles as a bayonet

    2. avatar Stinkeye says:

      Police said he faces charges of first- and second-degree assault, reckless endangerment and “several handgun charges.”

      He should also be charged with aggravated twattery for carrying nunchucks. Good lord.

    3. avatar Jus Bill says:

      It probably was the mayor.

  11. avatar Pulatso says:

    Increased judicial oversite? You mean there has to be something resembling due process before guns can be seized? Shenanigans I say!

    1. avatar Soccerchainsaw says:

      Given the state our many of our judges, I’m not sure this requirement should give us any reason to breath easier… isn’t this just another way to take away someone’s guns without having politician culpable in the confiscation? “I didn’t ban guns! The judge took them away!”

      1. avatar Kyle in CT says:

        Check out CT probate court sometime

      2. avatar Wood says:

        I’m with you soccerchainsaw, it does not make me feel better. Not unless there were also specific language to make everyone involved with the confiscation individually and criminally liable for abuse of the law. Make the intent of the law clear (novel idea in and of itself) and guard against the intentional abuse we *know* will follow. Kill the “sort it out later” mindset, and get it right the first time

      3. avatar Old Ben turning in grave says:

        Yes, as long as there are judges, even panels of judges, who rule that de facto no-issue (as practiced in NJ) is constitutional, the involvement of a judge does not ensure due process.

  12. avatar Gurney Halleck says:

    Im curious as to how they know the Ruger pistol was unfired. My Rugers don’t look unfired now but when they were new and I bothered to clean them up they looked unfired. Or are they trying to say his pistol was a virgin?

    1. avatar Matt in FL says:

      The word “unfired” was me paraphrasing. From the original article: “The hangun was loaded with six live rounds, but none had been discharged, the release said.”

      1. avatar Wood says:

        Was he in New York? Why the H E double-hockey-sticks would he only have 6 rounds in his 10-round mag? Never mind, he had nunchucks too….

      2. avatar Old Ben turning in grave says:

        Revolver? This guy sounds like a nut, but if he’s packing a single six he’s a nut with some style. At least IMO. For some reason I have always liked those. Never occurred to me to point one at anyone or their dogs, though.

  13. avatar Cubby123 says:

    Well Mayor Marty,that will make you look like you’re doing something! Doesn’t work,wastes money,makes criminals laugh,annoys gun owners ,gives Shannon,Diane,and Michael the giggles and overall a very stupid ploy,but that’s what libaturds do!They just can’t help themselves.

    1. avatar Old Ben turning in grave says:

      And it’s so much cheaper and safer than actually taking guns out of the hands of criminals.

  14. avatar Kerry says:

    How do I sponsor the kiosks? I would be happy to invest in boxes around the country for people to drop their guns into for me…no questions asked. I am behind this part of it 100% if I can be the one to empty the kiosks.

    1. avatar Jus Bill says:

      Wanna bet turn-ins that are worth anything “evaporate?”

  15. avatar fuque says:

    The City of Boston is welcome to make me an offer on any of my guns. As long as they can show me their FID Card.. my AR’s of coarse are off limits..If their citizens cant own them, why would I sell them to their government?

  16. avatar peirsonb says:

    So folks have to walk into a police department, which are almost universally civillian disarmament zones, with a gun in order to use the kiosks? Seems like a winning idea to me…

  17. avatar Wood says:

    I have carried my cell phone in the same pocket as a desantis-nemesis-holstered CCW. It helped break up the outline whereas it just looked too gun-shaped with the holster only. I’m sure most of you who do CCW can quickly ID someone pocket carrying. I recall seeing a guy fueling up his truck who carried a mouse gun in his back jeans pocket, no holster. It printed perfectly, almost as though it had been vacuum sealed.

    For pocket carry I have since moved on to http://www.Recluseholster.com but I wouldn’t recommend mixing pocket contents. I like that the trigger is immobilized by the rubber block. The whole package is thin due to the one-sided design. Drawing is easy and smooth. As for holstering, you “assemble” the pistol into the holster, then pocket the whole thing.

    1. avatar Racer88 says:

      I have a DeSantis Superfly. It comes with a detachable flap thingy that makes it look like a wallet. It does not have a gun- shaped outline.

      1. avatar Wood says:

        Yep. That’s the one I have. Hated the flap thingy. Without the flap it’s basically a nemesis. Since I got the recluse the desantis gets left in the truck as an alternative to a clip-on IWB. They all serve their purpose!

  18. avatar StevieP65 says:

    This was NO ACCIDENT!

    A fourteen year-old BOY had a gun illegally. He loaded it. He pointed it at his brother. He pulled the trigger. The ONLY place it’s said this was an ‘accident’ has been in the media. There is NO credible report to state this truly was an accident. Police had been called to this young man’s home many times. He ran away from a foster home last year.

    It was no accident.

  19. avatar Steve D. says:

    Those anonymous weapon drop-off kiosks will be very handy for Boston’s not-so-finest to pickup a new throwdown gun.

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