Open Carry Starbucks (courtesy newstimes.com)

“At this point, I think if Starbucks reverses its policy, we have no one to blame except ourselves. We’re already seeing hints this may be getting pushed too far by our own side. Last year, when this issue heated up again, I thought our side was working too hard to help the antis keep the issue alive. I think the best way we can help Starbucks is not to fan the flames. Keep spending your money there, and when the antis make noise, drop a note to corporate saying you’re a regular customer, and you appreciate their decision to follow state law on firearms.” – Sebastian, Time to Give Starbucks a Break: 2013 Edition [via pagunblog.com]

60 Responses to Quote of the Day: A Starbucks Too Far Edition

  1. Last year, people merely paid with $2 bills. That was a subtle way that gave a direct feed back to people counting the cash drawers. However, while I don’t think we should fan the flames. That said, we better not let the flames grow into a raging forest fire by ignoring them either. With vermin like Bloomer, we need to be playing “whack a mole.”

    Maybe the Newtown Starbucks didn’t realize that the number of permits to purchase firearms went up 16.25% during the first 6 months of 2013 compared to the entire year for 2012. There were 203 already issued through the first 6 months of 2013 in a down of just over 28,000.

    • Simple solution: keep paying with $2 bills. It’s a constant (and discreet) reminder of just how many of their customers care about the issue.

      Yeah, going to the bank to replenish the $2 is a minor inconvenience. So?

  2. As a former Starbucks employee, I’ve loved the fact that they as a business decided to stay out of the debate by following local laws regarding carry. I would like to see them continue this ‘live and let live’ policy regarding any issue in the media’s spotlight. I would also hope that gun enthusiasts also continue to ‘live, and let live’ though a few in every group won’t think that way. As far as I’m concerned, anyone’s rights end where mine begin, and vice versa. You don’t like to see me own/carry guns? Fine. I won’t push my lifestyle on you.

    What happened to being able to live with these differences? Has the melting pot been stirred that much that people expect homogeny? I revel in our nation’s ability to have a staggering amount of different cultures, and views. I also revel in my ability to pick the one I wish to support, and not feel pressured into being sensitive/accomodating everyone’s view should I not agree. Choice man, that’s all I want. Choice.

    • Melting pot isn’t the politically correct term. We’re a “salad bowl” now.
      Freedom of action, thought, and speech are all fine – as long as it’s in lockstep with the Hollywood, the Media, and the Corporate Elite. Sadly, I’m afraid it’s a matter of time before Starbucks knuckles under.

        • Sure can. Starbucks takes all the price heat, but I’ve yet to find a coffee shop at equal quality any cheaper (though my usual there is $2.04 w/tax). When I lived in upstate NY, Dunkin was their larger rival, and all the Dunkinites railed on Starbucks for their prices. But the same sized coffee with local/state taxes added was always just a tad *more* expensive there, as were many of the froo-froo drinks. Irony was lost on them.

          Speaking of Dunkin, what’s their policy?

        • Keep in mind, my comment was in the event “Star Bucks” were to go, “No Guns.” I am not sure about Dunkins. There isn’t a Dunkins around me, but there is a Krispy Kreme.

    • I wouldn’t say that the push for conformity is anything new. The United States goes though these turbulent changes all the time, we just get force fed the “melting pot” idea as if there was no discrimination outside of those of color. Think about how it was for the irish, polish, german peoples of the 1800’s, they were not welcomed, they conformed and eventually blended in over the course of 100 years or so. Now we celebrate their heritage with getting drunk and eating too much. Cinco de Mayo anyone?

      • True. However gun culture has been ‘unwoven’ from the mainstream. At least as far as I can see. I do live in a slave state however. So I may just be a little doom and gloom.

        • I agree with you and Chris both on this. However, being of Irish (mostly) heritage, ANY day I want can be St. Patty’s Day, but I leave the official holiday for the amateurs.

          But Cinco de Margarita? That only comes once a year!

    • Yeah…but unfortunately, they didn’t decide to stay out of the homosexual debate. Starbucks isn’t getting any more of my money.

      • Freedoms are freedoms Kyle. As easy as it is to say if you don’t like guns don’t own one, the same can be said for being gay, if you don’t like homosexuality, don’t be gay. Let other’s live as they choose. It’s not hurting you.

        • I wish more people felt this way. I don’t want anybody telling me how to defend myself, and I don’t want anybody telling me who I should love. That’s no business of the government or anybody else.

        • Exactly!
          Don’t like blue cars, don’t buy one. Don’t like movie theaters, don’t go. It’s very simple…

      • Starbucks has taken a lot of heat for the gun owners. Shouldn’t we cut them a lot of slack even if the feel they have to change the policy now. Write polite letters, make polite phone calls, be polite in the store, just let them know how you feel. And I feel that Robert got it right.

  3. Well they took a neutral stance on it… until they didn’t. I’ve written their corporate offices and will be waiting for a response from them to see if I will continue to spend $10 for beverages for my wife and I.

  4. well… they are just picking on Starbucks. are they going to go around to every possible retailer in the country and ask them to ban weapons in their stores as well? kinda silly really….

    • Well, considering they’ve done that for the environmental and homosexual agenda, I’d say the odds are good they’ll use the same tactics against the second amendment.

    • They have already gone to the National Museum of Play and had them pull Daisy BB guns and other type of guns or any toy which had a gun as a way to revise history, what is to stop them from going further?

      Have you not seen the pop-tart gun incident? Or the deadly pink hello kitty soap bubble squeeze toy called a gun where a 5yr old girl was suspended and sent to therapy?

      These people remind me of the same people who tried to abolish alcohol. And it was with the same misguided rational as well. Then it was the ban Rock and Roll crowd. Then we had the “ban fins from cars” crowd. We have had groups who have tried to ban things forever in our history. They are persistent because in their mind they keep playing tragedy over and over again and have this false belief that if “guns” or the word “gun” is removed then violence will magically disappear. In UK where they have pretty much done that, the Daily Mail has an excellent story over the weekend with great graphics to show violent many parts of the UK have become including central London.

      http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2013/08/keeping-kids-from-toy-guns-how-one-mother-changed-her-mind/278518/

      • Anti 2A anti gun extremists are using exposure and intimidation in a highly charged political environment to leverage compliance with their anti gun mind thought by inhibiting behavior of individuals and businesses. The new “Puritans” of our time.

        Some of their other tools: state restrictions and laws = high tech Scarlet Letters for gun owners and those who do not fall in line to condemn 2A free exercise.

  5. the squeaky wheel gets the grease.
    the really squeaky wheel sounds dangerous, and get replaced.

    from a poster at ‘shallnotbequestioned’:
    “When it comes to “carry” I live by out of sight, out of mind.”

  6. I had to look at the picture 3 times before I even saw the open carry gun , makes me wonder if you showed the picture to 100 people what would they see first.

    • I noticed because I didn’t think CT was open carry and the story was about Newtown. Plus, it looks more like a shirt riding over the pistol instead of “intentional” open carry.

      • Considering the lightness of the shirt, its logo, and the fact that it is tucked deeply inside the gun (which is in a large outside-the-belt holster), this fellow never intended it to be concealed. I also see that the Glock’s trigger is exposed. . . Even with the shirt over it, the lump shape would scream ‘GUN!’ The woman just going through the door, as well as having a nice rear bumper assembly, is making no effort to conceal her handgun, either–it’s on her left hip in a similar holster, and her light T-shirt would never cover it. So, what we see here is a group of people making a STATEMENT.

        I don’t like ‘statements.’

        You might be right that the 100 ‘regular’ people viewing this photo wouldn’t immediately see the gun, although it was what I saw first; The problem is that, when they DO see it, they’re likely to be surprised and maybe just a little uncomfortable, as they know that the people wearing them are most likely NOT ‘professionals,’ who don’t go out of their way to display firearms when out of uniform.

        Great way to keep Starbucks in our court, folks.

        • You failed to address the fact that CT is not an open carry state without a permit. As far as the shirt goes, I use a T-shirt to completely conceal a G20 all the time. It would require a pat down to find it.

        • You’re mistaken about the GLOCK-brand GLOCK’s trigger being exposed. That’s a molded Kydex holster where the Kydex has been “pressed in” to the trigger guard. It’s part of the retention.

        • I’m not trying to reply to me, but to you folks saying that the trigger isn’t exposed–zoom in on the holster. Trigger, trigger pin, slide release tab, clear view of the inner upper surface of the trigger-guard. . . that’s some darn impressive ‘molding’ to reveal all of that detail through kydex.

        • Kydex can show quite a bit of detail, down to individual lines on the slide. The top of the Kydex is parallel to the ground, and parallel to the top of the waistband of his pants. It cuts across the trigger guard at an angle, and yes, you can see part of the inside of the trigger area behind the trigger. You’re still going to have a very hard if not impossible time of getting something in there to pull the trigger. You’re inventing an issue that just isn’t there.

        • Apparently, I must bow to your wisdom and stand corrected. Reluctantly. . .

          “This new learning amazes me, Sir Bedevere. Explain again how sheep’s bladders may be employed to prevent earthquakes.”

    • 950 or so would not notice it at all. I think that’s already been proven. If someone wants to direct scorn at it, they have to point at it first. And then say, “we need to get rid of these; it’s for Obama.” And then….

  7. From the first linked article (The Inquisitr)… “out of respect for Newtown and everything the community has been through.” from Carr regarding closing the Newton store early on the scheduled Appreciation Day.

    Wait, you have a group of people in your community wanting to show support of a policy of Starbucks but you are going to close your store early out of respect for everything the Community has been through. Celebrate the Victim much?

  8. I totally agree with the sentiment. I’ve been CC for almost 30 years now and that’s my business. I get that some people open carry in other states, but a lot of people freak out at the sight of a gun unless it’s a police officer. I’ve known that for awhile. I have my own service business and make sure to keep my weapon concealed here in Massachusetts. I personally don’t like people to know I carry. I still have my friends who are 2nd Amendment guys who will ask, “are you packing today?” and things like that. I just remind them to be cool. The left and the Occupiers are the “Protesters” in my book. We know who we are. Go to Starbucks and get a friggin’ latte and support them, but don’t make it a battle ground for us against them, because I believe there is a segment on the left that will counter protest anything. (The unemployed loser class. LOL) We will not be portrayed favorably in the media, and it’s not fair to Starbucks if they have to close a retail location because their coffee shop becomes a circus, wether they support us on principal or not. Don’t give the anti-gun crowd any ammo. (Pun intended of course.)

  9. This will end poorly for us.

    I think the tactical issues of open carry mirror the social issues quite well. If you present yourself in an in-your-face manner then you make yourself a target. If you remain covert, you aren’t as much of a target. Showing your whole hand from a position of disadvantage is stupid, in self-defense and in activism.

    It’s like it’s not enough for some people to exercise their rights without interference or backlash. They want to be able to do it plus have people’s approval of it. They want to do it plus flaunt it in the faces of people who disagree. If it’s not enough to exercise your rights for practical reasons and you feel like you need to be making a statement all of the time or tweaking anti-s and being cocky about your views then you are probably an a$shole. You care more about your ego in the here-and-now than the cause in the long run. I’m not saying don’t open carry if you need to, but don’t go out there specifically to kick hornets nests because you get off on the sight of the swarm.

    Starbucks has stayed out of the gun debate. And that’s good enough, and hell, that’s the model behavior we should want to achieve with more stores and movie theaters and stuff like that. Rubbing it in everyone’s face is going to eventually force them to enter the debate. They’re not going to like that, and therefore we are not going to like the outcome.

    If the place doesn’t have proper signage indicating no guns allowed then leave it at that, carry your gun, and don’t make a big deal about it. Don’t give them a reason to put a sign up allowing them the possibility of putting you at a legal disadvantage. Don’t ask them a question that’s going to make them bring lawyers into the decision making process.

    -D

  10. I find it pathetic that any firearms owner even
    supports Starbucks at all until they make a decision to support the second amendment
    without strings attached.

    • Maybe, but as a major international business, Starbucks’ policy of simply allowing what is legal by local laws goes far and above many other businesses with contradictory corporate policies.

      • I only mentioned Starbucks because they are the topic.
        There are certainly other companies that should be held
        accountable as well for their not permitting firearms in their
        place of business or allow firearms to be carries legally inside
        their place of business but also have strings attached.

  11. Amen. Those of us who support gun rights need to be normal above all else. The goal is not to feel good as we self-righteously yell (literally or metaphorically) at the other side, but to convince the folks in the middle, and to do that we need to appear to be safe, rational, responsible and not looking for a confrontation.

  12. It’s all well and good to support Starbucks because of their “neutral” gun policy but the whole appreciation day event thing didn’t happen in the eyes of the majority of Americans. If they did see it in the MSM, you can bet it was given a negative twist. I asked a lot of acquaintances what they thought about it and I got blank stares. Most of the “not a gun enthusiast” U.S. just doesn’t care. My take for the little it is worth; I don’t go to Starbucks, call it a boycott if you wish, because of their political contributions and support of the democratic party. OK, I can carry my gun in their stores where legal, something I should be able to do anyway….big deal. That doesn’t negate the fact that they are helping to fund a political organization that wants to take my right to own a gun away. Skip the $5 coffee and sent a contribution to the NRA, it’ll do more good.

  13. I appreciate their good sense to stay out of the debate. I don’t know why people on either side are trying to drag Starbucks in– they sell coffee. 7-11 sells coffee too, and I’ve never heard a complaint from a clerk if they happen to see my holster when I get out my wallet.
    Stores and companies have my respect for honoring the laws of the states their in, but I honestly don’t feel like I owe them any gratitude outside my regular patronage.

  14. Too far? You can never go too far. If you don’t open carry while concealed carrying body armor, silencers, RPGs and tactical nukes on you, you are a commie loving 2nd amendment hating liberal who loves giving money to Obama.

    At least that’s what was told to me when I didn’t fully support the open carry movement in my town.

  15. You know what really angers the far-left, the anti’s, and their ilk? Calm, Logical obstruction of their ideology. Support the businesses that support your right to carry and defend yourself, you family, and others. Support them with your business, send encouraging emails to their corporate offices letting them know you appreciate them.

    If more gun folks would take the time to see who actually supports firearm ownership and carry, there might be a tidal shift in who gets money and who doesn’t.

    For example, is going to see the latest hollywood flick more important than you right to self-defense? Most theater chains have posted notices with the international symbol for no guns, and you are in violation of the law if you enter with handgun, which in many states removes your protection of the law in a self-defense case. Solution? Don’t leave your handgun in the car, just don’t go.Email the management. Favorite restaurant posts a no-gun sign? Find a new one, and let them know.

    Counter the foaming idiocy of the FOR THE CHILDREN rhetoric right back into their faces. But do it politely. Politely also means keeping your weapons hidden. Open carry just scares people that might be on our side philosophically but don’t like guns in a practical way. Terrify people by making reasoned, well researched responses to their ignorance.

    Also, lets work on getting more people on our side by not standing for racism within our own community. A big part of public relations is making yourself look a look better by appealing to as many people as possible, and the gun community would go a long way toward that by condemning the good ole boy culture and accepting that minorities in the big cities need our support even more than the folks in rural areas.

    What a huge blow it would be to the anti’s if pro-gun organizations started contributing toward inner city programs, holding youth gun safety camps for at-risk kids, and helping put pro-gun progressives (i know, weird right?) into positions where they could help change the laws to benefit everyone.

  16. I don’t drink coffee. Before the open carry dust up i had never been in a starbucks. Because I live in California I have never open carried in a starbucks. But as a show of support I do now occasionally go to a starbucks, usually with grandkids in tow, and buy hot chocolate and odwalla’s. I will continue to do so so long as starbucks respects the gun communities rights.

    • I go because there is a Baskin and Robbins next door. Granddaughter gets her Odwalla, I get my two scoops of chocolate almond!

  17. Something that hasn’t been said, but I think is VERY IMPORTANT:

    There were several hundred people from outside the state who were planning to visit the Starbucks in Newtown, CT., to make a national statement about gun control. That one local Starbucks decided to close early to protect the local people from a National SPECTACLE in their city. I support that policy. And you would too, if they were coming into your town or city, trying to tell you how you should think or vote. (For example, the MAIG No More Names tour.)

    All the other Starbucks around the country remained open, right?

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