Update: Vast Majority of NY Counties Pass Anti-SAFE Act Resolutions

OpposeNYsafeAct

Like I said the last time we saw this map (albeit with much less green), there is a MASSIVE rift between New York City and the rest of the state. And I can’t wait until these counties decide to ditch the city and form their own state. [http://www.nysaferesolutions.com/]

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About Nick Leghorn

Nick Leghorn is a gun nerd living and working in San Antonio, Texas. In his free time, he's a competition shooter (USPSA, 3-gun and NRA High Power), aspiring pilot, and enjoys mixing statistics and science with firearms. Now on sale: Getting Started with Firearms by yours truly!

54 Responses to Update: Vast Majority of NY Counties Pass Anti-SAFE Act Resolutions

  1. avatarArmchair Command'oh says:

    They need to just pinch off that southern part and give it to New Jersey.

    • avatarWilliam says:

      NO WAY. They’d insist NJ belonged to THEM.

      • avatarRobert M says:

        Let them fight it out. That would produce another PA and just make NJ with a few more Congressmen

        Thanks
        Robert

      • avatarchuck says:

        Duh they already do. Didn’t you see the adds for the F1 races that were supposed to come to nj but they all said ny or the stadium the ny giants play in oh and lets not forget most of the jersey shore cast is from ny.

    • avatarBLAMMO says:

      HEY!! I live in that southern part. And misery loves company. If I’m not free, nobody’s gonna be free.

      Just so ya know, the population of those 8 downstate counties far exceeds that of all the rest. Thanks partly to the upstate ghost towns created by Andrew’s old man Mario back in the ’80s.

    • avatarMy Name Is Bob says:

      Can we just sink it into the ocean instead?

  2. avataruncommon_sense says:

    And the plot thickens …

  3. avatarJohnny says:

    Fingers crossed for Clinton County. They have a nice Gander Mountain in Plattsburgh.

  4. avatarWilliam says:

    Last time I checked, ALBANY was the capital of New York, not Scamhattan. Why can’t the rest of the counties tell the five counties (I think) that comprise NYC to take a long walk off a short pier and form their OWN state? Scamhattan, the 51st state, and the original colony of New York.

    • avatarDyspeptic Gunsmith says:

      You need to take into account the apportionment of the seats in the NY Legislature…

      Politics in NY State is controlled by basically four groups:

      - NY City
      - the “outer areas” around NYC (Long Island, Westchester and other limousine-liberal areas)
      - the Albany/beltway cities (Albany, Syracuse, etc)
      - the western cities (Rochester, Buffalo)

      The rural areas of NY State (which is a large number of the upstate counties) are always told to “go pound sand” by the cities.

      • avatarOld Ben turning in grave says:

        More population > more seats in the legislature > they make the rules. Until, technically, they bump up against the constitution, which was designed specicially to prevent the majority from having their way with minorities in general (with cities effectively enslaving the countryside as a particular concern).

    • avatarroscoe says:

      @ William:
      Succession; that’s unlikely.

      The problem is the liberal voter density in the large metropolitan areas that keeps mindlessly putting the Democrat extremists into office. It’s the same problem that exists in California and most recently Colorado.

      It’ll take a groundswell of dissatisfaction, rejection of their actions and votes to put these extreme politicians out of office and regain equilibrium. Until that happens, the only likely recourse is through the court system.

    • avatarElliotte says:

      The reason the rest of the counties can’t just tell NYC to pound sand is thanks to the Warren Court and the Supreme Court Case Reynolds v. Sims http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reynolds_v._Sims

      Prior to this case, most states had a bicameral (two-house) legislature set up similar to the US Congress. There was a lower house (House) of the legislature with districts based upon roughly equal population size. And there was an upper house (Senate) of the legislature with districts based upon the counties or other non-population based districts.

      Eight of the nine justices ruled that this type of setup violated the principles of “one person, one vote” and struck down legislative districts that were not based upon population.

      What is needed is for state senate districts to be set up based on counties or other geographic areas similar to the setup of the US Senate. This would help prevent the tyranny of the majority in many of these states, but it would require a reversal of the case mentioned above.

      • avatarNor'Easter says:

        Darn it Elliotte, you beat me to it and are right of course.

        This was Jefferson’s nightmare, the urban mob, through their elected charlatans, lording over and wreaking the Great Republic of Independent, Yeoman Farmers.
        Once upon a time this situation was kept under control by most state governments set up like the US Congress. The Lower House by population and the Upper by “District”.
        NJ, for instance, had 2 Senators for each county with the rural ones easily outvoting the urbans. As you can see from the NYState map such a system would never have allowed the Safe Act to pass.
        This all was to change with “Symonds v Sims” by the Warren Court which decided this was a violation of the “Equal Protection” clause and determined that all state legislatures must reform to reflect the population.
        Since most states had entered the Union with the systems they had, indeed some predated the formation of the United States, there was much resistance but they gradually fell in line.

        Slowly but surely it’s been a march to urban domination ever since and we’re seeing the results.

        Like you say, the only fix is a reversal by the SC but I don’t see that happening. I think a Constitutional Amendment may have to be done by the states and they better get to while they still can.

        Ben and the Gunsmith lay it out as it is – frustrating and unfair.
        What is really getting scary is that – like they say – the constitution is supposed to guard against “mob rule” but if the judges are flunkies of the Establishment, where then will it all end?

        • avatartdiinva says:

          Back in Jefferson’s day the Urban mob consisted of way less than half the population. Now the Urban mob is 90% of the population.

        • avatarElliotte says:

          Actually, the NY State Senate should have been able to stop this one already, without any changes. Republicans outnumber Democrats in the NY Senate, but enough bowed to the Gov’s pressure to rush this through without reading it. From introduction through passing it out of the NY Senate, this thing only took 24-48 hours I believe, and many NY Senators voted on it without having read it.

          Where this type of change would help is my homestate of MD, CA, IL, etc.

        • avatarNor'Easter says:

          To tdiinva and Elliotte -

          Without quibbling about numbers – I don’t think it’s 90% yet – Jefferson was projecting into the future and how right he was.

          As far as the NY State Senate, it’s true that even with the Reynolds v Sims decision the Senate was still Republican and bills such as the latest abomination went there to die. This, unfortunately, is no longer true. At present it is ruled by a coalition of Republicans and “Independent Democrats” thus allowing such stuff to slide through.
          Maryland is interesting, The usual large, urban area and upscale burbs dominating a rural Bay Area and the wild and wooly west. Downstate Illinois is the most tragic example. Unfortunately I think Washington, Oregon, Vermont may follow, Reynolds has taken time to sink in but is working it’s magic.
          Good luck there and thanks for your input.

    • avatarPJM361 says:

      Upstate will never let or want NYC, Nassau & Suffolk to leave because our taxes keep them afloat. And this is from an upstate paper: http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2011/12/upstate_ny_grabs_more_than_it.html

  5. avatarJohn says:

    Is adopting a resolution just a way of saying the county disagrees with the law but will still legally be required to follow it?

    • avatarOld Ben turning in grave says:

      Unless the county Sherrifs chose to act, I am afraid they resolutions are indeed symbolic.

    • avatarDaniel Silverman says:

      John this is actually a really good question.
      Now technically if the Sheriff’s stand with the county law, they trump everyone, even the feds. So basically what it would come down to is gathering up state employees, i.e. police from NYC to go out and enforce laws in other counties. As far as I know these police would be leaving their jurisdiction so this is really nullification. Now the Sheriff from NYC could in theory be sent out to enforce the laws, I believe, but they would be facing off against local Sheriff’s. That would be a big FUBAR situation from the get go. I guess they could bring in the national guard, DHS, or ATF to try and enforce the state law, but the minute they did that it would get, well.. You can figure that one out…

  6. avatarRoll says:

    Did anyone show this to Cuomo? This is like a giant middle finger to his face.

    • avatarSammy says:

      As long as it doesn’t look like a gun, he’s cool. He’s used to gettin’ da boid (NYeese for bird).

  7. avatarJoey S says:

    This map is discrimination against red/green color deficients like myself

  8. avatarData McBits says:

    WOW! Go New Yorkers! Fight!

    Colorado should take a cue from these guys.

    • avatarSammy says:

      Like myself and others have pointed out, the heart of the state of NY is not to be underestimated. Cuomo is really pulling a tiger’s tail. And all for bull s$it reasons that undermines the country as a whole. He is no statesman but he makes up for it by being a lousy politician.

      Doing everything but calling Mikey Bloomban out by name, Judge Andrew Napolitano’s article “What is Nanny is a thug?” on Lew Rockwell’s site asks a few disturbing questions and worth a read, IMHO.

      http://lewrockwell.com/napolitano/napolitano91.1.html

      I love Judge Napolitano.

  9. avatarCommie IL says:

    If you were to make a map of IL, it would look the same. Accept here SH*T runs uphill.

  10. avatarHidden Hills says:

    looks like a map from Hunger Games

  11. avatarAnon says:

    Great news!

  12. avatarChuckN says:

    While this is encouraging, I just want to point out that New York, even
    upstate NY, still primarily votes democrat. Teri Weaver of the Syracuse
    Journal just published an article that claims that half of Upstaters say
    they will vote for Cuomo again.

    http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2013/03/despite_new_york_gun_laws_abou.html

    Here’s the actual voting data

    http://www.elections.ny.gov/2012ElectionResults.html

    Maybe if NY’s residents had showed this much interest and
    resolve during Cuomo’s bid for governor, NY might not be in this
    mess.

  13. avatarDB says:

    And that map is even out of date, Seneca and Chenango counties are now green. Broome, Sullivan, Columbia, Essex and Clinton have votes coming up and are likely to go green. Monroe Co, half-assed it with a non-vote (signatures) “passage” of a resolution, but call it light green. By the end of March we’ll have the entire map green except for Tompkins (uber-liberal Ithaca, NY’s version of Boulder), Albany and metro NYC.

  14. avatarBob in Boston says:

    I was disappointed to see that all of this just amounts to the counties expressing their displeasure. I was hoping it was more like the ones in other western states where they literally passed legislation saying they would arrest anyone who tried to enforce unconstitutional laws, even if they were Feds. That’s been entered as a bill here in Mass too, but I know it has no chance whatsoever of passing – the lib-tards here are completely anti-gun, even though once you get outside of the Rt 95 belt Mass is very pro-gun.

  15. avatarNS says:

    what percentage of the population is that?

  16. avatarNS says:

    By my count, adding up the populations of all the counties that have not proposed and are unlikely to imo: Kings, Queens, NY, Richmond, Nassau, Suffolk, Westchester, Tompkins and Schenectady, we get a total of 10,873,887. That’s over 50% of the population of New York according to the 2010 census, and that’s assuming that all the places that have not passed their measures will pass them, or that count will raise, and it could raise substantially.

    Unfortunately I think we’re encouraged by large green swaths when the people that Cuomo cares about (the city) already support him

    • avatarDave says:

      This may be of use when the law gets amended, which it will have to because they overlooked too many things passing it in haste. There have been noises from Skelos about revisiting the magazine size limit, which wouldn’t have happened without this pushback. These efforts may have at least some effect, and something is better than nothing. It may at least slow down or prevent additional legislation in the near future.

      It’s always worth a fight.

  17. avatardwb says:

    does any one know what proportion of the legislature the green represents?

  18. avatarMothaLova says:

    The main reason, I think, why New York State doesn’t cut off New York City has to do with money – that is, New York City has money and the rest of New York State doesn’t. I’d still favor cutting out New York City – better to be poorer and free than richer and enslaved – but if such a proposal were actually before the state legislature, I think you’d see a lot of folks get cold feet.

    • avatardwb says:

      first they gave us toxic subprime CDOs. then massive unemployment. now this. i say make the whole island a prison they deserve to be locked up

    • avatarDon says:

      Yes has somewhat to do with money, but not really. The rest of the state has plenty of assets and advantages, it’s do fine independent of NYC. What it has to do with is power and the desire to control others. The progressive tyrants in NYC would never let the rest of the state loose to pursue their own vision and lives. To NYC lefties, their vision of the world is THE ONLY vision that matters and they want the maximum amount of people to abide by it. They know better and they would never free upstaters from that vision – and they would NEVER reduce the power that leftist ideology holds in Washington by effectively hiving off what would more or less be a red state, or purple at best.

      Upstaters would separate in a heartbeat, money be damned. It’s just that NYC would never let them leave. Upstaters are doing a life sentence in a progressive NYC jail.

      • avatarjohnmackay70 says:

        Actually, the tax rates in the whole state are extremely high partly because of all the “programs” created in the city. So many companies have left or are leaving much of upstate NY over the last 10 years just to get out of that burden.

        I believe Upstate NY would do much better if they did not have much of their tax dollars going to the city.

  19. avatarJSIII says:

    Maybe it is time to split New York into “New York State”(NYC, some surrounding areas) and “West” New York (the rest of the state) ?

  20. avatarLiveFree says:

    “Power to the People”

    Statements like that make President Obungu and NY Governor Cumo very angry. They can’t rule like the communists that they are when people challenge their authority.

  21. avatarOne If By Land says:

    NY would never let NYC go (there was a small movement afoot years ago in NYC to secede from the State, but it never gained traction because the state ended it by paying off the city) plain fact is NYS gets most of its revenue from NYC, than the city gets back from the state. The never-ending drumbeat is the city subsidizes the rest of the state. I live in one of the (upstate) Counties (just outside of Albany) which jumped on this resolution band wagon early in the game (like 3rd or 4th), they’re very pro-gun here. It’s actually suprising its in NYS. The County Judge and Clerk are all pro-2A supporters.

    In NY, the state has a supremacy clause for all firearms related laws, with the explicit exception for Cities with over 500,000 in population, which is why NYC can pass its own gun laws – other than that, everyone else is neutered from passing their own laws (which js generally good, as it avoids a patchwork of differing laws which would be a nightmare to navigate). Other than resolutions, which have no power in law…counties cant do much of anything. It was just a means for them to let the state know how they feel. The only thing the Sheriff can do is not enforce it at a local level. But there are plenty of state LEO’s to do the governors bidding….just would take a little longer….

    • avatarNor'Easter says:

      A very perceptive tome and very true. Besides, aside from the Metro Area there are hotbeds of Urban Mobery in lots of Upstate cities and towns from Buffalo to Albany, they might overwhelm the rural vote in time in any case.

  22. avatarBierceAmbrose says:

    Sure, “more money.” You always have to force people to take a better deal under threat of arrest.

    *Albany* gets most of its money to “redistribute” from downstate. Upstate would secede in a heartbeat, and let them keep their money with their meddling. The problem, of course, is losses & impositions from ill-fitting policies *don’t* show upon the balance sheets.

    PA and Washington state work about the same way, sadly.

    The only upside here is Cuomo-the-Younger has shown himself unequivocally to be a high-handed statist and unabashed progressive. I suspect that a (another, actually) move to build his “record” for his upcoming presidential run got too much general press. Everybody noticed vs. having just a talking point to present to his base with cameras banned from the room.

    • avatarNor'Easter says:

      It’s amazing to me that this is generally the way that the Federal System works. Most of the blue states put more in than they take out yet they keep voting for reps who keep doing the same thing.
      When I’ve pointed this out to individuals they are surprised and think it’s outrageous yet they keep on voting the same way.
      Ideology over all ? I dunno.

      • avatarBierceAmbrose says:

        Ideology over all ? I dunno.

        Yes, but “ideology” in being unable to stand other people living some way they don’t agree with. Whatever happened to “mind your own business?” There is no “your own business.” The rest follows.

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