Negligent Discharges at Three Gun Shows

The timing could have been worse, although it’s hard to see how. Talk about giving ammo to the antis . . . “A portion of the American population celebrated Gun Appreciation Day by attending guns shows across the country,” Greta McClain at digitaljournal.com reports, “resulting in some of the attendees perhaps appreciating paramedics and first responders more than guns, at least temporarily.” See what she did there? Well, here’s what they did at three—count ‘em three—guns shows yesterday, via the more sanguine Wall Street Journal . . .

Three people were injured in Raleigh, N.C,, at the Dixie Gun and Knife Show at the state fairgrounds, a quarterly event that usually draws thousands of people. State agriculture department spokesman Brian Long said a 12-gauge shotgun discharged as its owner unzipped its case for a law enforcement officer to check at a security entrance.

Two bystanders were hit by shotgun pellets and taken to a hospital. A retired deputy sheriff suffered a slight hand injury . . .

In Indiana, police said a 54-year-old Indianapolis man was injured when he accidentally shot himself while leaving a gun show.

State Police said Emory L. Cozee was loading his .45 caliber semi-automatic when he shot himself in the hand as he was leaving the Indy 1500 Gun and Knife show at the state fairgrounds. Loaded personal weapons are not allowed inside the show . . .

authorities in Ohio said a man was wounded at a gun show in Medina when a gun dealer was checking out a semi-automatic handgun he had bought and he accidentally pulled the trigger.

The gun’s magazine had been removed from the firearm but one round remained in the chamber, police said.

No deaths resulting, but the bad PR from these negligent discharges could help derail attempts to derail the trend towards civilian disarmament, leading to more deaths. So . . . bummer.

Still, it must be said: someone else’s lack of responsibility whilst exercising their Constitutionally protected right to keep and bear arms shouldn’t affect your rights. That’s not how it’s suposed to work, is it?

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About Robert Farago

Robert Farago is the Publisher of The Truth About Guns (TTAG). He started the site to explore the ethics, morality, business, politics, culture, technology, practice, strategy, dangers and fun of guns.

80 Responses to Negligent Discharges at Three Gun Shows

  1. avatarSCS says:

    Morons are not helping the cause.

    • avatarDan says:

      worse yet are the idiots here and on youtube who criticize gun safety advocates, dismissing them as “safety sallies” and other insults.

      bet you 100% those idiots who ND’d are exactly those same morons with cavalier attitudes toward cooper’s 4.

      • avatarTaylor Tx says:

        Yea definitely a case of “I didnt really want a hole in my hand, what was that rule about destroying stuff again?”

        Whats worse, is that the guy who was loading his ccw in the parking lot had to be breaking more than one rule to actually get that extra hole :)

        I think the term safety sally needs to DIAF and be replaced with Safety Steve (who does not fuck around when it comes to safety.)

    • avatarpat says:

      Thats exactly why they should teach gun safety at school, because guns are everywhere and education is good (isnt that what the libtards say).

  2. avatarLinebackerU says:

    Nearly all of the articles about these shootings included the phrase “the gun went off when…”

    I hate that. The guns went off when the idiots pulled the trigger while pointing it at somebody.

  3. avatarJames W says:

    Meanwhile in Chicago……

  4. avatarMike DC says:

    They need to ban stupidity not ARs and AKs.

    • avatarCurzen says:

      mandatory IQ test? the higher you score, the bigger the caliber and larger the magazines you may buy.

      • avatarNot Anon in Ct For Long says:

        Except that IQ and common sense are not all that correlated. I know folks with 140+ IQs who don’t remember to tie their shoes

  5. avatarRandy Drescher says:

    Still not quite as bad as thousands killed each year because they didn’t have a gun, Randy

    • avatarJPD says:

      Agreed. But since the local media only reports those, no one does the math.

      The main point here is that the mainstream media has an AGENDA. To dis-arm all of us.

      So, every little incident, will get nationwide attention. Making us all look like the idiots at these gun shows.

      • avatarMEV says:

        ^^
        JDP nailed it on the main stream media AGENDA.
        Hard to fix stupid on the accidental discharges…
        Not going to help the cause.

  6. avatarjwm says:

    There’re 80+ million gun owners in America. Given how few accidents happen I don’t see this being a big gimme to the grabbers. Accidents are going to happen regardless of the activity. I drove past a car wreck on 880 just yesterday.

    • avatarJim R says:

      When every single time a gun goes off in your neighborhood there’s a news crew around to cover it, every incident like this–every ND makes us look bad.

    • avatarDaniel Silverman says:

      880 ha that is a hell of a highway.
      We hit about 2000 at the rally, and I can say no opposition from what I saw, and we left it cleaner than we found it.
      I hope you made it JWM.
      But you are right think about all the car accidents…
      The just crashed when I…..
      See what I did there!

    • avatarOld Ben turning in grave says:

      It does help neutralize any good that gatherings at state capitols did, however. I didn’t seem much coverage of those.

  7. avatarGreg Camp says:

    Control freaks never can manage to do math correctly. A handful of injuries on a day when thousands went out to celebrate gun ownership? A handful of injuries in comparison to the vast numbers who attend gun shows in a given year?

    Gun control has nothing to do with numbers. It’s all about exploiting events that draw attention with the purpose of controlling everyone.

    Squirrel!

    Oh, we’d better ban something!

  8. avatarimrambi says:

    I have seen many people at my LGS grab a gun and the finger goes on the bang switch. Many of the people lack training that do this. If they admit that they do not have training then various training facilities are highly encouraged.

  9. avatartjlarson2k says:

    Rationally speaking, the only action that needs to be taken in light of these unfortunate ND incidents is that the organizers of those gun shows (or gun shows in general) should reevaluate their procedures and setup regarding the location and entry points for gun owners that bring their own firearms to the show vs. people that are just wanting to go to the show without a firearm.

    Whether that’s means creating a different line that’s away from the crowds for the folks bringing in firearms (in the event of a malfunction or ND) or just adding more precautionary measures to prevent collateral damage in case of an accident.

    Done and done.

  10. avatarMike in NC says:

    On the bright side, no ARs or AKs were involved…

    The Raleigh show apparently shut down after the shotgun incident yesterday but reopened as scheduled today. Attendees were not allowed to bring any firearms to the show on Sunday and we were all checked by metal detectors at the entrance.

    For those interested, some prices were insane! Low-end ARs that would have sold for $575 a few months ago were tagged at $1200. Decent ARs were anywhere from just under 2K to just over 3K. I didn’t see any high-end ARs for sale today. Used GI mags started at $30 (looked like they’d been run over) and went up to $45 (decent looking). Pmags that I saw went as high as $60. I saw a few AR-10s that were marked up around 50% higher than what I remember pre-panic. My personal pick for “most outrageous price increase” goes to a stainless/synthetic Ruger 10/22 (not a takedown model) priced at $515.

  11. avatarBob says:

    Right, so how many car accidents or how many people cut themselves while cutting vegetables for dinner?

    Accidents happen. Don’t mean anything other than dumb has coincided with unlucky.

  12. avatarWilliam says:

    Let’s see. Three gun discharges at GUN SHOWS on GUN APPRECIATION DAY, ALL “ACCIDENTAL”. Maybe the only three such discharges EVER.

    And in NYC, on 9/11/2001, three steel frame buildings collapsed “due to fire”; the only three EVER. ON THE SAME DAY.

    Someone will cry “truther!”; another over there, “conspiracy theorist!”. I DON’T CARE. See it for what it really is: a conspiracy.

    As in, two or more people getting together and agreeing to to something. That’s all a conspiracy is.

    • avatarConway Redding says:

      Well, it was due to jet fuel fire and aircraft impact, and while I’d hate to see TTAG turn into a debate about what happened on 9/11/2001, will point out, the following, as reported by a structural engineer: “The actual maximum burning temperature of a Jet-A fuel (standard jet fuel type in U.S.) is 980 deg. Celsius. If you refer to the Iron-Iron Carbide phase diagram, the temperature at which steel changes from cementite and pearlite (strong phases of steel) to austenite (significantly less strong) is 702.5 deg. Celsius. Also, if a steel structure is exposed to a temperature just below or at the eutectic (702.5 deg.) for a period of time, martinsite is formed (very weak). All it would take is a few I-beams to lose their structural integrity before the ‘chain reaction.’ If this is true, the collapse of three steel-framed buildings following exposure to aircraft impact and the resulting jet fuel fire is no great mystery.

      • avatarSoccerchainsaw says:

        You gotta love someone that knows their science…

        Of course I’ll have to take you at your word since my area of expertise tends to be more in the electrical field, not the metalurgical.

      • avatar16V says:

        Except that the buildings were designed to survive a direct aircraft strike. And that the fire that started from those strikes were very, very small. And the Jet A all burned off in a few minutes.

        The martensite explanation sounds great because as it is an actual process, it sounds science-y. I have had plenty of metal treated in my life. To warm up a bunch of massive I-beams that are also interconnected as a massive heat-sink with some quick burning accelerant and an office fire? Never in a million years. Even if you could heat them up that hot? To quench out that austenite to the point of forming excessive martensite? Millions of gallons of water all at once. Then, one would still need yet another event to trigger a brittle failure of high-martensite steel.

        Most importantly, it was the first time any high-rise building had failed that way. Not one, not twice, but three times all in one place. Never before in the history of high-rise construction, and never since.

        Steel framed highrises have been fully engulfed (with massive 100+ foot flame curtains roaring up the building) for hours before they weakened at all. Even then, they slowly deform, they don’t ‘collapse’. And progressive collapse does not happen at free-fall speed. Or perfectly uniformly.

        There are credentialled and credible scientists, metallurgists, and architects who actually do materials testing, actually design highrises, and they will all tell you the NIST story contradicts 100+ years of highrise knowledge and design. I’ve met more that feel the same, but putting that out in public gets you labelled with the non-science types. AE911truth.org is a one of those groups of non-nutters who looks to the science for those who aren’t crazy, but also know the whitewash was just that.

        Note: I’m not getting into this one any more than I already have. This isn’t the forum, and I don’t have the time today even if it was.

        • avatarConway Redding says:

          Thanks for the clarification, which sounds at least as “science-y” as what I posted. I agree that this site is not the place for the debate about what really happened on 9/11, but I continue to find the conspiratorialist theories less credible than the “official explanation,” if only because those theories entail the coordination of the activities of hundreds of people, and, as is often said, two can keep a secret if one of them is dead, so I suspect that in the 11+ years since 9/11 at least one of those involved would have let something slip.

        • avatarConway Redding says:

          “Except that the buildings were designed to survive a direct aircraft strike.”

          Yep, from the much smaller Boeing 707. But in any event your comment reminds me of the fact that the Titanic was designed to be unsinkable. I’m open to the possibility of, um, design flaws.

        • avatar16V says:

          Takeoff weight of a 707-320B in the early 60s was maximum take-off about 330,00 pounds. When the WTC was designed.

          That “much larger” 767 was all of 400,00 lbs maximum takeoff. BFD. +%20 means about nothing, and you could tell that watching the videos – the buildings didn’t flinch when the jets hit. In engineering terms, there are far more stressful wind events.

          Once again, it seems compelling when spun, until you actually know and understand the numbers. Just like looking at The Titanic. With our knowledge, we know quite well it was a failure waiting to happen. WTC I and II were not.

  13. avatartjlarson2k says:

    I think what needs to happen is the pro-2A folks need to gather all the news for the same day the NDs occurred and show just how much pro-gun material we can find that isn’t being reported (DGUs for example).

    • avatarJustin says:

      I’ve been thinking about this for some time now, but since you mention it…

      RF and TTAG Gang, please post as many DGU stories as you can get your hands on. Every day. Encourage the AI to contribute. I’d like to see a lot more of the DGUOTD stories that used to be posted here. The casual web surfer would get an eyeful when they stumble onto this site.

      • avatarMike in NC says:

        Post DGUs when they are found, but PLEASE start checking the DATES of the source stories. Some of the DGUs that have surfaced on the interwebz over the last few months have been YEARS old.

        • avatarSkeev says:

          I think it should still be valid. If gun grabbers still want to bring up Columbine why not bring up every DGU from that year and since?

      • avatartjlarson2k says:

        This is just my two cents, but I primarily visit TTAG because it’s simply the most current and active blog that covers all the important aspects about firearms.

        It’s a blog that makes you think, question, and improve your mindset about being a responsible gun owner.

        Every DGU that is reported and examined on TTAG is a public service not just for gun owners, but for anyone interested in self-defense, law, criminology, psychology, and tactics. They are a wealth of knowledge.

        Each DGU, while unfortunate, has life-saving lessons and information that should not be overlooked. Not only do those stories assist in mental preparation, but every DGU that ends up with the victim walking away is also a victory.

        After all, those involved in DGUs that hopefully survive are someone’s brother, sister, son, daughter, neighbor, father, mother, grandmother, etc. They’re a member of the gun community, our community. And larger still, they are ultimately a member of our society and our country. We’re all in this together.

    • avatarLarryR says:

      Just one small detail being overlooked: If it isn’t reported anywhere, how the cathair you gonna find it?

  14. avatarLance says:

    Where the idiot who lets live ammo next to the guns in the same caliber there where selling.

  15. avatarRalph says:

    Interesting that the reporters didn’t say that “the guns went off.” So it seems like they’ve switched from demonizing guns to demonizing us.

    • avatarSoccerchainsaw says:

      In the Main Stream Media, guns only go off in the hands of the people they think should have them, i.e. police, military, etc. The folks that aren’t supposed to have them well, what do you expect and see we told you so…
      I’m not really sure that this represents a switch in their most preferred method of spin.

  16. avatarmike says:

    Weren’t AD’s just laughed at in the good ole wild west days?

    • avatarSoccerchainsaw says:

      Maybe so but our understanding of safety has come a long way since then. These are like minor incident close calls in industry. Each one may be fairly insignificant but the pattern can expose a flaw in the corporate safety culture that increases the probability of a major incident. Like safety professionals we need to continually evaluate and improve our community’s safety methods.
      In my youth I remember that a high school girl that lived nearby was killed by a ND by one of her kin returning from a hunt. More recently someone I know to be very knowledgible about firearms and safety accidentally shot his own finger. I think that these days we should know better than to laugh at any ND.
      Just my take on this. Shoot straight and be safe. Your brother in arms…

  17. avatarGov. William J. Le Petomane says:

    At least there were no fatalities. That would have given the grabbers something to run with.

    I’m not sure how you shoot yourself in the hand while loading your .45. Must be one of those 1911 things.

  18. avatarORGO says:

    These gun shows must have pretty loose rules. The ones in my area require that ALL guns be not only unloaded, but tied with heavy duty zip ties through the breech or barrel, and/or locked so they cannot be loaded or fired in any way.

    These idiots either forgot the first two rules of gun safety, or never knew them in the first place.

    • avatarduke nukem says:

      they were from North Carolina… what the fudge did you expect

      • avatarSoccerchainsaw says:

        While I’m originally from good ole’ WV, I’ve been living in NC now longer than anywhere else, so…
        HEY! I resemble that remark!
        I guess everybody’s gotta be from somewhere…

    • avatarMike in NC says:

      The NC show rules were not loose. The incident happened at the table where just such a zip tie would have been applied after confirming the chamber empty.

  19. avatarJoseph says:

    Did they report on how many traffic accidents there were yesterday? Any day?

  20. avatarensitu says:

    I am open to the posibility that these guns did not load themselves and that perhaps the person(s) that did the loading had a political agenda

  21. avatarOfc. Scott Martini says:

    Thanks to those dumb shits that didn’t check their firearms before they put them in their cases. Just when it’s about to get ugly these dolts just made it worse.

  22. avatarFyrewerx says:

    Most media is stating that these were “accidents.” My ass! All three peeps who were the main cause of these incidents should have known better…. more so the gun dealer. NOT accidents! …. Stupidity!!!

    • avatarduke nukem says:

      or the gun show for letting LOADED shotguns inside

      • avatarSoccerchainsaw says:

        Anybody have any more details on these incidents? The local news here in NC reported the following:
        1. The incident in Raleigh occurred at the entrance when they were checking what the guy was bringing in to the show.
        2. Not sure I remember what they reported about the Indianapolis incident. The above indicates the guy was reloading his gun after exiting the show.
        3. The Ohio incident was reported here as happening at the gun dealer’s store.

  23. avatarConway Redding says:

    Well, I guess we need all the bad publicity we can get. But seriously, folks, with NRA membership figures in the neighborhood of 4.5 million, and considering that not all pro-gunners are members of the NRA, there is no way we can escape having in our ranks some who are not,as they say, wrapped too tight. The anti-gun folks have no monopoly on stupidity and lack of foresight, although I like to think that owning a firearm predisposes a person to be very, vary careful. At least careful enough, for example, not to be toting a loaded shotgun in a carry-bag. Oh well.

  24. avatarJan says:

    Maybe a “highly-trained” officer could clear weapons at the door instead of asking owners to show them.

  25. avatarSilver says:

    Three more days like this and we’ll have equal the number of bystander injuries as one shootout involving the NYPD.

    I don’t really see how this is bad publicity. The sociopathic antis and leftists have made no bones about the fact that they wish gun owners dead for the heinous crimes of personal responsibility and adherence to the Constitution, so you’d think they’d encourage more gun shows in the hopes more things like this would happen.

  26. avatarJOE MATAFOME says:

    Three people were killed in drunk driving accidents in my state last week, so I say we ban that evil alcohol (prohibtion worked really well as we all know) and we should hold those greedy car makers pay for those lost souls. I don’t feel it’s right to blame the poor old drunk slob that killed the innocent victims because he must have had a bad childhood and he just couldn’t help himself. If a few bad gun owners make the gun grabbers want to ban all our guns, then a few drunk drivers should force all alcohol and cars to be banned.

  27. avatarBob says:

    Another one in Pflugervill Texas (just north of Austin) on Saturday:
    http://www.kxan.com/dpp/news/local/austin/man-shot-at-pflugerville-gun-range

  28. avatarSomewhere in NC says:

    I was at the Raleigh show on Saturday at the time of the discharge, but didn’t see or hear the shot. Witnesses discussing the event afterwards said an officer was securing a pistol after the owner removed the magazine and both failed to check the chamber. The officer was using a zip tie to secure the trigger against the grip and the pistol fired. Hours later it was reported the discharge was with a shotgun and birdshot. Not sure how the story changed. Even the local news had it reported as a pistol discharge and later updated to a shotgun. Very strange.

    • avatarAlphaGeek says:

      It’s not at all strange that there was confusion in the wake of the ND. That is the norm, not the exception.

      Regarding the actual procedure described:

      First, this may be the first publicly documented instance where a magazine disconnect would have prevented a ND. How ironic is it that it was a LEO who pulled the trigger in violation of the safety rules?

      Second: WTF kind of idiot thinks that zip-tying the trigger is a GOOD idea? Not only does it require the trigger to be actuated during the “securing” process, and I use that word loosely… It prevents potential buyers from checking to see if the gun has a functional trigger mechanism. Far better to stick to a big-ass zip tie through the action and the mag well, no?

      • avatarDan says:

        LEO are frequently the worst when it comes to safety.

        +1 on ziptie through the magwell and action. WTF god damned moron zipties a trigger? it would have to be a LEO, wouldnt it.

  29. avatarbrian.z says:

    What about the fact that one AD happened when a person was reloading after leaving the show? I don’t know the full story, and he still must have broken one of the rules to shot himself, but should he have been forced to unload in the first place? Everyone knows if you don’t touch it to unload/load then the gun doesn’t go off. Not making excuses for unsafe behavior, just an observation.

    • avatarAlphaGeek says:

      Requiring people to unload their CCW weapons and reload them later is provably more hazardous than simply allowing them to carry as per normal practice.

  30. avatarJAS says:

    Gun safety 101 violated. Not much else to say except that: IF YOU HAVE A GUN IN HAND, IT IS ALWAYS LOADED UNLESS YOU CAN PERSONALLY SHOW OTHERWISE. What is so hard to understand about that!!!!!! IF YOU DON’T KNOW ANY BETTER DO NOT PUT YOUR FINGER ON THE TRIGGER! SIMPLE.

    JEEEZ!

  31. avatarBilly Wardlaw says:

    “was loading his .45 caliber semi-automatic when he shot himself in the hand ”
    I’m not even sure how you could manage that, but ok.

    2 questions – How often to accidental discharges happen at gun shows and are there any 1st hand witnesses to these news stories? and secondly, how many people where injured in car accidents going to and from gun shows this weekend?

    • avatarMike in NC says:

      I’ve been in the building for one AD in all my years of attending fun shows: Amarillo, TX somewhere around 1993-1994 during the last big push for gun control.

      • avatarAlphaGeek says:

        Which, coincidentally enough, tends to bring out all the inexperienced fence-sitter buyers and haven’t-shot-in-years profit motivated sellers who collectively know F-all about practicing firearms safety.

  32. avatarJesse says:

    I’m willing to bet they were as a result of people new to the idea of owning guns; the sort of fella that never had felt a “need” to own a gun prior to the current climate telling whereby making him thinking he might get one now while he still can.

  33. avatarDave S says:

    Weapons are inherently dangerous when negligently handled.
    Its a risk folks at gunshows accept. No one has to expose themselves
    to that risk, so if you are afraid stay home!

    Wonder how many shows were held this weekend involving how
    many thousands of folks. probably pretty low risk of anything
    happening. but that wont be reported.

  34. avatarMike says:

    Unfortunately I think we will be seeing more NDs in the near future. Once or twice a week I go window shopping at the local stores. I can’t help but to see more and more ‘little to no experience’ people buying guns. If you listin to some, you know they are an accident waiting to happen.

    I go to the range a few times a month too. I find myself watching for the inexperienced shooters more and more. Barrels pointed to the side, fingers on the trigger before aiming, etc. the scariest is people shooting a handgun to powerful for their abilities oe experience.

    Last week a guy took his girlfriend shooting for the first time. Her first shot was with a 1911. Although he thought her reaction was funny, others were not amused.

    With all these new shooters out there, don’t let your guards down!

  35. avatarSkeev says:

    I guess this is going to start hurting the people who offer gunsmithing services at the shows now.

  36. avatarjosh says:

    I was 30 feet from the “accidental discharge” in Raleigh and through I didn’t see it I heard it. Let me go on record as saying it didn’t sound anything like a shotgun, even a .410. To further complicate it by the time I got home some two hours later(after a stop at a local firearms store) the local news was reporting that the gun owner removed the magazine but left a round in the chamber. They went on to say the retired LE went to zip tie the trigger and slide, subsequently firing the round. An hour later the local media reported the weapon had changed from an obvious semi-automatic pistol to a shotgun and the line “The weapon discharged before any of our employees had ever taken possession or touch the firearm or had an opportunity to make it safe” was added. I’ve read everything now from the gun owner dropped the shot gun on the table and it went off to he was unzipping the bag and it went off.

    They went on to make sure everyone knew it was an accident. I’m not a conspiracy theorist by trade but I can see a conversation between the gun owner and the LE where an offer is made not to press charges so long as he colaborates that they never touched the weapon.

  37. avatarAlan Rose says:

    From what I hear (wish someone could link to documentation) it wouldn’t be the first time anti-gun activists have “seeded” a few rounds into chambers or cylinders at a gun show.

  38. avatarLisa says:

    REALLY??? Some of you actually believe that all three of these guns accidentally went off on the first Gun Appreciation Day it the midst of all this gun control talk?? Seriously!!! Please use your critical thinking skills before it is too late for you and your family……I was in the military for 9 years and I never once witnessed an accidental discharge. Please start seeiong the bigger picture or you will be expaining to your child and grandchild what freedom use to be…..

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