NY Gun Ban: So Much For ‘Justifiable Reliance’

Many semi-auto rifle manufacturers have developed neutered versions of popular modern sporting rifles for our brothers in California, New York and New Jersey. Some of them have their flash hiders and bayonet lugs ground off, and some of them have ‘bullet-button’ magazine releases. Some of them have thumbhole stocks, or worse. Many of them are restricted to magazines of 10 rounds, instead of a normal 20 or 30. 

None of these totalitarian-state compliant rifles (to my knowledge) have ever been used in the commission of a crime.

But all of them are still semi-automatic rifles, and they all cost real money for their manufacturers to develop and for their owners to purchase. Manufacturers and shooters spent extra money to develop and purchase these limited-run rifles, and justifiably relied on existing laws in the reasonable belief that they would be allowed to keep and use them. Now in NY they’re all contraband, thanks to a bill that most of the legislature didn’t even read.

But Andrew Cuomo doesn’t give a damn about that; he had to ‘do something’ and by God he was going to. And damn the cost. Or the Constitution.

And now every New York shooter who spent extra money purchasing a ‘NY-compliant’ rifle is, in industry parlance, SOL. As you read this, these (formerly) NY-compliant guns are probably ‘leaking’ out of the Empire State as fast as their owners can legally move with them to other states.

75 Responses to NY Gun Ban: So Much For ‘Justifiable Reliance’

  1. avatarJaguar Golf says:

    How’s West Virginia?

    • avatarWilliam says:

      Mountainous. Nice people. REALLY nice people.

    • avatarJSIII says:

      It is beautiful too, I love visiting WV

    • avatarShane says:

      As someone who has lived here for over 4 years, and is returning to the even more gun friendly state of KY, I will say WV is very nice.

      The people are nice, some are a bit strange but overall they are good God fearing folks. Not a lot of opportunities outside the mines, but it’s peaceful and quiet. Beautiful scenery and if you enjoy outdoorsmen activities and sports it’s almost heaven.

    • avatarTRUTHY says:

      How’s West Virginia?

      Full of guns and law-abiding citizens. Over 90% gun ownership and the lowest crime rate in the nation. Loving every minute of it.

    • avatarbontai Joe says:

      West Virginia is a wonderful place, small town feel full of nice folks. I’ve always like my time spent there. Two things to keep in mind, you can’t get a decent cheese steak sandwich or pizza, but diner breakfast food is great (I like fried eggs, sausage, home fries, and heavily buttered toast, yeah I know it ain’t healthy, but it tastes so good)

    • avatarBlinkyPete says:

      I’m surprised no one’s mentioned the meth. It’s spectacular there. Fresh as a mountain stream, toasty as a warm blanket. Yessir, you’ll come for the guns, but you’ll stay for the meth. Generally for 10-12 years if it’s your first offense.

      I kid, I kid.

  2. avatarDirk Diggler says:

    better question: when is a class action lawsuit or challenge getting filed?

  3. avatarDrDave says:

    Here’s one non-native New York resident who’s taking his high dollar income outta here as fast as possible. Guns are moving next week. Good f-ing riddance! You won’t miss the $100k I paid in state taxes last year. There are lots of welfare queens who might though.

    • avatarRandy Drescher says:

      Good on ya Doc, hope you find someplace sane, Randy

    • avatarGov. William J. Le Petomane says:

      I can understand why people stay in California – the weather is nice, but what exactly is the appeal of NY? High taxes? 16 oz “big gulps”?

      Wherever you go, enjoy the weather and keep fighting the good fight.

      • avatarBrooklyn in da house says:

        Family.

      • avatarNew York Stagehand says:

        Bklyn’daHouse answers it for many people.
        I’m lucky, even my extended family is getting p.o.’d at the Statist over reaches and thinking of going back to PA where we can still fight for freedom.
        As soon as my income is totally portable, I’m going to big sky and bigger hills.

        Meanwhile I’m sending my New york money to Gura and our local groups.

        • avatarLevi B says:

          On the up side, PA has stand your ground now!

        • avatarHSR47 says:

          Levi: That was a hell of a fight. It took FOAC 7 years to get it through the legislature (Rendell promptly vetoed it in 2010), and 8 to get it through the legislature and signed into law.

          If you’re in PA, I implore you to become involved in FOAC’s legislative action: The yearly rally is scheduled for April 23rd.

          Additionally, A group of PAFOA members is planning a rally for next Wednesday (January 23rd), also at the capital.

          For both events, we need to fill their lockers with our guns so that they have to find alternate places to store firearms. Also note that in the past they have refused to accept long arms.

    • avatarensitu says:

      Idaho or Wyoming

    • avatarblinkypete says:

      Come to New Hampshire! We need help kicking Jeanne Shaheen out on her backside next year.

    • avatarAaronW says:

      I’ve been urging people who move out of NY State to send Governor Cuomo a letter in which they describe their income, taxes paid, aggregate economic activity, and why they’re moving.

    • avatarChris Dumm says:

      DrDave, TTAG thanks you on behalf of a grateful nation. If enough Americans in New York think like you, we might be able to drain the swamp.

    • avatarDr. Mike says:

      I have decided to bail as well. Any suggestions as to where?

      The Mrs. thinks Georgia since she was raised there, I was thinking the Florida gulf coast since my attorney (brother) is located there. Any reason to choose or avoid either that you fellas can think of?

      • avatarBrad says:

        FL Gulf Coast is wonderful but look at SC near Beaufort as too. An hour from Charleston or Savannah and very quiet. Low taxes and very, very friendly people.

  4. avatarJohnnymcsmith says:

    Hope this doesnt fly those in WV. Or that its not true.

    http://westernrifleshooters.wordpress.com/2013/01/15/manchin-gets-his/

    • avatarPascal says:

      They voted him, he broke his promises, so now vote him out. He has been wishy-washy for sometime – first he wanted the ban, then his citizens that elected him protested, and he backed down. Now he is on the Ban wagon again. From that link he is making political calculations shows by his words and his deeds, he does not give a fvck about what WV citizens want but to stay in good graces with the democratic party. He says he does not believe or support of self defense. He already sold out the coal minors and now the gun owners, I see little reason he should keep his job come the end of his term.

      He should be reminded of that up to and after his ass is booted from office and made an example for those who next want that seat of power.

      It has become abundantly clear that many politicians could give sh!t about their people and only care about their political aspirations and self conceived agenda.

      The work to fire that moron must begin now!

    • avatarLSUTigersFan says:

      Nailed it on the picture.

      [Hint: Vidkun Quisling]

  5. avatarchewcudda says:

    any newyorker needing to move his guns to another state….I am looking and will pay good money for some of them…
    AR AK Cetme Century golani, fals, JRC.
    I am here to help.

    • avatarThrownunderabusinWV says:

      I got my form letter back from Manchin today. Basically says he never advocated an AWB, just a “conversation”. Followed closely by his willingness to work with Feinstein on a solution. Go figure.

      As far as WV is concerned, the northern and southern parts of the state are two completely different worlds. Go north.

  6. avatarDrVino says:

    I’m happy to help.

    WTB: Saiga rifle in .223

    Me: in SoCal.

    You: maybe in NY?

    Sorry,can’t buy mags > 10 unless I can send you limiters and you put them in and send that way.

    I’d prefer it unconverted, but….

    Find me on AKFiles.com
    PM me.

    • avatarAlphaGeek says:

      DrVino, you can legally receive any size mag if it is disassembled into a “rebuild kit” first. I have four 30-round PMAGs in my safe right now in “rebuild kit” form which I can either assemble with capacity blockers, or take with me on trips to NV/AZ/etc and assemble as 30-round mags after I leave CA, then disassemble before I return. All 100% legal… Under current law.

      Seriously, move fast and get yourself some rebuild kits just in case we can’t stop Leland Yee.

  7. avatarLance says:

    Time for all NY progun shooter move to PA now.

  8. avatarJohnnymcsmith says:

    PA your AG is boning up your reciprocity for CCW permits.

    • avatarHSR47 says:

      That’s why we’re investigating our options for restraining her legislatively, as well as ways of removing her from office.

      Don’t be surprised if you see recall petitions circulating in the near future.

  9. avatarRalph says:

    Any regulatory taking violates the 5th Amendment Takings Clause, whether or not the law passes 2nd Amendment muster. I expect that the lawsuits will be flying, as they should. The question is whether any New York court is unbiased enough to issue a temporary injunction. Given the degree of adherence of other NY courts to the Constitution, I’m not sanguine about the chances. I’m also thinking about the issue of standing. Who has the right to bring the lawsuit? Do you have to lose the property before you can sue? That’s the way it usually works.

    • avatarMark N. says:

      Given the decision in Kachalsky in the Second Circuit, pretty doubtful, absent a grant of cert. From Alan Gura’s Petition for Cert to the USSCt:

      “New York remains among the minority of states in which the “right to carry weapons in case of confrontation,”District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S.570, 592 (2008), remains illusory. State law treats the carrying of handguns for self-defense not as a right, but as an administrative privilege lying beyond the reach of most people. Asserting that bearing arms is too dangerous to allow as a matter of course, New York forbids responsible, law-abiding adults from carrying handguns for self-defense unless they first demonstrate a “proper cause” to do so. By definition, “proper cause” must exceed the self-defense interest citizens ordinarily hold.”
      The rationale of this decision is that the Second Amendment right does not pass beyond the threshold of the home. Again from the Petition for Cert:
      “The court below stands among those holding that the Second Amendment has no practical impact beyond the threshold of one’s home. Reasons for this conclusion vary – the right to bear arms outside the home is alleged to be non-adjudicable by lower courts, Heller is alleged to be limited to its facts, or as the lower court reasoned, the “core” self-defense interest identified in Heller is alleged to be limited to the home, such that rational basis review (styled as intermediate scrutiny, but rational basis review
      nonetheless) governs elsewhere.”

  10. avatargreat unknown says:

    If we were liberals, we would be boycotting Remington, which makes Bushmasters and other filthy, scary killer guns in New York. But we’re not liberals, so we’ll just keep sending money via Remington’s corporate taxes to those nice people in Albany.

    Or Springfield in Illinois.

  11. avatarblinkypete says:

    BushChris- while I know it doesn’t matter what type of gun is used in crime, CT has a version of the old AWB in effect, and the Bushmaster used by the monster at Sandy Hook was likely a ‘neutered’ ban compliant model.

    Other than that excellent read. This new law is nothing but vindictive and putative.

    • avatarstokeslawyer says:

      This is an issue not receiving much coverage from the media. The CT ban was basically the 1994 federal ban, word for word. The AR-15 used at Sandy Hook was “legally obtained” by the shooter’s mother. This means that it was either compliant with the 1994 federal ban or grandfathered in (if CT allowed grandfathering). The renewal of the old ban would have had no impact on the “lawful” existence of the Sandy Hook shooter’s weapon. I guess the media does not want to dig too deeply into these facts.

  12. avatarGeoff says:

    FYI to clarify the BAN in NY, all currently grandfathered firearms “pre 94 ban” will be grandfathered still but must be registered and can never be transferred even in death in state. Previous AMB compliant guns have the same rules. No new semi-auto w/ detachable magazine and “one” evil feature guns. All “Pre-Ban” normal/high-cap magazines are toast, current 10rd magazines are grandfathered but we can only load 7rds into them. No new magazines of 8rd or greater.
    NYSRPA and the NRA put out a statement today that they are looking at the law with a team of lawyers and will be taking action soon. also anyone know how to load 7rds into an M-1 Garand E-block clip?

    • avatarSDFreeman says:

      It can be done

    • avatarAaronW says:

      I went to a state-run range in PA, where you can only put three live rounds in a rifle. I was shooting my Garand, so I loaded five “dummy” 30.06 rounds, and manually cycled them out.
      Wanting to do the right thing, I flagged one of the enforcement officers and told him about my idea – he said, “at least someone’s following the rules.”

      • avatarHerb says:

        Aren’t there three round en bloc clips for the Garand?

        I know you can’t hunt with an autoloader in PA but I never heard of this unless it’s just a range regulation.

        • avatarChris Dumm says:

          Is that actually a law (the mind reels) or another pussified rule from the range sissies? Tri-County outside of Portland is run by single-shot chauvinists who think you’re plotting Revolution if you fire more than one round every few seconds. What a waste of range space.

  13. avatarSilver says:

    -And now every New York shooter who spent extra money purchasing a ‘NY-compliant’ rifle is, in industry parlance, SOL.-

    Only if they allow themselves to be.

  14. avatarRob Eide says:

    Go back to your hole TROLL.

  15. avatarBill says:

    And there it is. It’s not about the guns. It’s the hate for people you think your better then. I’m sure any awareness of your bigotry escapes you. I don’t hate liberals, I pity you.

  16. avatarMilsurp Collector says:

    “lethal killing weapons”
    Guns are inanimate objects like rocks, tree branches, and toasters; they don’t sprout legs, walk around, and start harming people on their own. Demonizing guns because they’re “potentially harmful” means jack scheiße and is a failed argument. Any object can be potentially harmful if used by an operator with evil intentions. A loaded gun sitting alone on a table is as lethal as a steak knife in a kitchen drawer. It’s all about the intent of the user, not about the object itself.

    Now kindly crawl back under your little stone bridge, Mr. Troll.

  17. avatarJC says:

    No, we are not Nazi Germany or Pol Pot. I agree there is too much alarmism on this forum. However, whether it is banning the size of drinks that can be purchased in New York City, or banning certain weapons for law abiding americans, with the full understanding that these weapons were used in less than 1 percent of murders in New York, New York is certainly not libertarian. It seems clear that the leaders of New York believe they know what is best for all of their citizens, and are determined to ram it down their throats whether they like it or not. It seems clear to me that they believe in the outsourcing of people’s individual security to the armed wing of the state–the police–unless you can afford to hire armed security like many of New York’s progressive hypocrites. It seems clear that in New York the state is determined to promote the greater good, at least their definition of it, at the expense of individual freedom, and that the voters of New York by and large believe in this vision as well. It seems clear that New York’s leaders believe that they can legislate away the darker side of human nature, and are willing to punish good, law abiding, people in order to test their vision. So, I agree, this is not totalitarian on the scale of Naziism or Pol Pot, but it is absolutely the vision of a benevolent autocracy. As with the monarchy’s and dictatorships of times gone by, things can be fine under the right leader in these systems. However, when the state holds all of the power, when that leadership errs, which considering human fallibility is virtually inevitable at some point, the people are irretrievably linked to that government and go along for the ride, usually to their demise. So, perhaps the state of New York, and America, may not be totalitarian now. However, if the voters continue to approve the prohibition of big gulp drinks, restrictions on their rights in the name of safety, and are increasingly reliant on the government for their very livelihood, then they will have no recourse but to stick with the sinking ship when that less “enlightened” leadership arrives. So please stop condescending to the members of this board, however over the top their opinions are at this moment of agitation, because clearly the hood of the benevolent government is fully over your eyes and you are in denial about the darker aspects of human nature and state power no matter what the intentions are at the present.

  18. avatarOne If By Land says:

    …and so the next round begins in NY…in today’s NY Post:
    “The law also bans magazines holding more than seven rounds, yet has no provision limiting the number of clips someone can buy. So a Newtown- or Aurora-style mass-killer can simply bring dozens of legal-capacity clips, which could be swapped out in just a second or two during a shooting spree.”

    http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/new_law_has_lot_of_holes_BORK25RPsC6r4jNwBUpdVK

  19. avatarAaronW says:

    I was just at my favorite LGS in Yonkers. The guy running it is a cop – he can sell guns, but without any mags! He has to keep them in his shop!
    He also can’t sell any ammo until he is “authorized” to do so, and God only knows when that will be.
    Unbelievable…

  20. avatarAharon says:

    New York: the state that hosted America’s first capital before it moved south to the Potomac River and is still the home of West Point. Today, the NY State Government practices some of worst abuses of liberty and civil rights in America upon its residents.

  21. avatarGrege says:

    So anyone looking to sell these guns out of state is going to take a big hit on the resale value. Who in a free state would want to buy a neutered gun for an inflated price?

    • avatarKen says:

      They’ll have no problem selling them to us in Kalifornia. Demand is still strong and our guns are already neutered.

    • avataradamt says:

      I am sure you can sell them in the dirty jerz. Until they get there ban all figured out. Move outta NY and head to Pa. You can still commute and have freedom. Just saying

    • avatarChris Dumm says:

      Neutering=castration. Just pointing that out.

  22. avatarUpstater says:

    According to this article a recent Tax Foundation study no less than 60% of cigarettes in New York are bootlegged to avoid the state’s taxes and regulations.

    http://preview.tinyurl.com/aoy4ebj

    Just sayin’

  23. avatarCrunkleross says:

    And everyone thought the AF2011-A1 didn’t make sense.

  24. avatarJoe Doakes says:

    It will take me three years to get out of the NY racket. Two if I’m lucky. Life is one big trap in the north east.

    I’m done getting stuck in it.

  25. I’ve avoided arriving in the US Chicago for years due to their hatred of armed citizens, so now I’ll add New York.
    It might only be a few hundred $ a year in airport fees/taxes but I’ll be damned if they get a penny if I can avoid it.
    Looks like Atlanta or Dallas from now on.

  26. avatarAlan says:

    Am I the only one that can read? The Newtown shooter left the Bushmaster rifle in the trunk of his car, did not use it. Duh!

    • avatarder says:

      No your not the only one to pick up on that sick fact. Actually, I watched the video of the cops with the long gun in the trunk, and it looks to me like a shotgun. The PD is “racking” the forearm to eject the shell. I don’t think there ever was a .223 used by Adam. The whole country was LIED to about Sandy Hook. By the way, what happened to that man in CAMO that was found in the woods, next to a school that just got shot up? Maybe he used a .223. I smell a total cover up, just to take the guns!!

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