h/t to gunalizer.com
Well, that’s not the answer that the witch wanted to hear.
But was she shocked to see that the NAACP thinks Trayvon needs the SYG law on HIS side. laugh. It went right by her.
An NAACP spokeman says the law does not permit Zimmerman to “hunt and kill” Martin. “Chase?” “Hunt?” These words don’t fit the facts I’ve read. I wish they would provide oral citations to the facts they’re using. That would be helpful to me. And now they are trying now to build the incident as a SYG right of Martin to inflict ‘serious bodily injury’ upon Zimmerman even though Martin was invisible to Zimmerman as the fighting began? Why was Martin still sitting on Zimmerman pummeling him as Zimmerman cried out for help and a witness said ‘stop’? Why did Zimmerman not shoot earlier in his sat-upon beating if Zimmerman was so aggressive? Have to find a way to spin that somehow. Nice effort….and begging the question completely as to who engaged whom in that backyard, assuming it away. Thus the effort to say ‘hunt’ and ‘chase’ as often as possible, as if Zimmerman were in hot pursuit, aggressively. They’re just starting to get it, that the facts are going to require yet another baseless reworking of the case for Trayvon long before the SA investigation is complete. This is a typical struggle to get the case to a verdict even before anyone seats a jury.
Police report sure does not appear that Zimmerman was chasing and hunting very well.
I think I recently got some friends to understand what the stand your ground law was about by making them see that it could apply equally to either party. If things had turned out differently and Martin had somehow ended up killing Zimmerman in an act of self defense, then the stand your ground law would protect him. I’m glad to see that Benjamin Jealous gets that.
Ben Jealous gets it and he also knows that many (if not a majority) of FL’s SYG cases involved black and Latino defendants who were able to avert prison by asserting SYG.
SYG has proven to be completely colorblind in FL, which is pretty remarkable.
While I think Ben’s reference to SYG was meant to invoke in public a new theory of why the beating was OK, it is exactly the minorities and rural poor in FL, together with the elderly, who most needed a SYG law. “As applied” it provides these groups with the confidence to defend against gang members and other predators. The law-abiding in these groups have always (and rationally) feared providing themselves with armed defense. This put them at a severe disadvantage against predators with no such compunction.
it is exactly the minorities and rural poor in FL, together with the elderly, who most needed a SYG law
FL doesn’t publish any demographics on STG usage, so I can’t state with certaintly whether or not the rural poor or the elderly are being helped by it. Based on my review of as many newspaper stories as I was able to find, minorities have been a major SYG beneficiary.
I may be very wrong about this law, but it seems to me that the law sort of supersedes a lot of jurisprudence. The law seems to protect anyone who claims self-defense when there is ambiguity about what happened in his or her case. Am I wrong about this, Ralph?
Among other things, the SYG law eliminates the duty of a defender on the street to retreat. “No duty to retreat” can be seen in Federal case law for two generations, but federal case law has no applicability to state crimes. “No duty” have also been part of some state’s case law since long before SYG statutes were a blip on the radar.
SYG also requires that to arrest a person claiming self defense, the police must have probable cause to believe that the defender’s claim of self defense is wrong. That’s different and a step up from simply finding probable cause to believe that a crime has been committed.
I’m in favor of SYG, but that doesn’t mean that I’d actually stand my ground. IMO, anyone who would rather kill someone than beat a hasty AND SAFE retreat is nuts. I view SYG as prophylactic. It protects from overzealous arrest a retreater who has to shoot.
Prophylaxis is why I also favor open carry laws. I probably wouldn’t open carry even if it was legal, but open carry laws save innocent CCers from arrest for flashing.
Amen to your views on SYG and open carry. I would certainly try to remove myself peacefully from a dangerous situation, if I could do so in safety. I would not open carry myself, at least not in the gun-shy urban area of Megopolis where I live, but I want that legal protection from the idiocy of accidental “brandishing” being punished with religious fervor.
That’s how I feel as well, especially about open carry. Washington is an open carry state, but as we’ve discussed before, I personally wouldn’t want to deal with the extra hassle that seems to be associated with it at this time. But I like knowing that I’m not going to be in any legal trouble if somehow my gun is inadvertently exposed.
Just noticed, name misspelled in headline.
Many seem to have missed that Florida law does NOT allow an aggressor to stand his ground (776.041). An aggressor DOES have a duty to retreat before claiming self defense in a deadly force case. This may be what the case will hinge on. Here’s the statute: http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.041.html
I think TM would be offended by all the people calling him — 17 years-old 6’3″ — as a ‘boy’ (and not a man) as an old insulting racial stereotype.
He was old enough to enlist, and just a year short of voting rights. Another year beyond that age we can find many combat veterans.
The youth card is being played to almost as much a fare-thee-well as the race card.
I understand the racially charged meaning behind using the word boy, but I sincerely doubt that’s what meant here. I think the media keeps calling him a boy as a reminder that it was in fact a minor who was killed. He WAS 6’3″ and could enlist, but he was still a child in the eyes of the law, so I think that language is just meant to reinforce that.
The Mass Media is playing the youth card as much as the race card, by “reminding” the public he was “just a child”.
All the photos of Trevor are of the happy variety. George is shown in what looks to be Orange prisoner garb. The media continues to work up a frenzy over this. The Merchants of Emotion won’t be content until a counter incident occurs they can report on. The Black Panthers are putting up 10000 dollars to try and create one right now.
I am shocked, SHOCKED to learn that the Moguls of Media would slant the reporting of the news!! I heard the “new” BP’s upped the offer to $1,000,000. Inflation is everywhere.
NAACP is not stupid regarding law. It is refreshing to have someone point out in the mass media that stand your ground would be on Trayvon’s side if Zimmerman was stalking him as the released 911 calls suggest.
That said, “do not attribute to malice that which can be easily explained by stupidity”. Zimmerman is likely not a super racist… just a moron who made a fatal mistake.
The tragic lost life of a 6’3″ football player can never be recovered. The victim had his nose broken, cuts on the back of his head and grass stains on his back ! Treyvon Martin was old enough to put George Zimmerman on his back! He was old enough to take a bullet! TREYVON MARTIN GOT JUSTICE!!!!!!!
Barack Obama is doing all he can to make the American Nations fall. Well you know what you five faced husband of a Bitch. I have had enough of this bullshit if you try to “take” our guns away you are responsible if someone gets hurt. And if someone gets hurt right after you take their guns away then they are gonna sew YOU and your Bitch ass wife. Then since you WILL LOSE you WILL BE IMPEACHED!!!!!! YAYYYYY
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