Irresponsble Gun Owner of the Day: Andrew Seals

There are more classes than you can shake a stick at about how to retain your gun in a struggle, but not one I’ve found that addresses how to go #2 without firing off your piece. Maybe Andrew Seals from Mesa, AZ can start that class now that he knows first hand what a porcelain throne ND looks like.

azcentral.com has the stinky details:

Andrew Seals entered a bathroom stall about 1 p.m., at a Walmart at McKellips and Greenfield roads, and began to sit down when his Ruger .357-caliber Western-style revolver fell out of its holster and fired a round, Mesa police Sgt. Ed Wessing said. The bullet went through the stall door, hit a wall, ricocheted into a light on the ceiling, then back onto the floor toward a man standing at a urinal, Wessing said. The bullet struck the floor about 5 feet from the other man, he said.

Call me crazy, but I don’t think that gun hopped out of the holster and started shooting willy nilly. And if it did, it was because Mr. Seals was carrying his revolver with the hammer cocked.

More likely, Andrew was toying with his gun and didn’t keep his booger picker off the bang switch. So please put your hands together and congratulate Andrew Seals on his shiny new IGOotD trophy along with his possible felony conviction.

comments

  1. avatar CarlosT says:

    If he was constipated before, he’s probably not now…

    1. avatar Anthony Meruelo says:

      I read a story once by a guy that once dropped his 1911 while dropping the kids off at the pool and it landed on the hammer but went to half cock instead of bang. He says his sphincter shut so tightly he had trouble going for a couple days after.

      1. avatar CarlosT says:

        Yeah, I guess it can go either way.

  2. avatar Tank03 says:

    In my first handgun class, the instructor had us each go into the bathroom in order to figure out what to do with our particular model of gun when seated on the can. It generated some of the most discussion of the entire class.

    1. avatar S & T Admin says:

      Censorship sucks TTAG. Don’t make me pull your 2012 Gun Blog of The Year Award!

      1. avatar Robert Farago says:

        TTAG’s posting policy: no flaming the website, its authors or fellow commentators. This policy is an integral part of our success. If you consider it “censorship,” that’s your right. Please note: we also discourage comments about our editorial stance or style underneath an unrelated (i.e. non-Housekeeping) post. If you want to discuss these matters, please ping guntruth@me.com.

  3. avatar Ralph says:

    Ruger experts will know more about this than I do, but I seem to recall that older Ruger single action revolvers did not have a transfer bar. If such a gun was dropped it could go off, even if it wasn’t cocked. That’s why such a gun cannot be carried with a round under the hammer.

    BTW, had the errant round actually penetrated the guy at the urinal, the gun would not have been the only thing that was uncocked.

    1. avatar "Dr." Dave says:

      Yes, this is actually true.

      Ruger Blackhawks and many, many other older single action revolvers with out modern safty devices will indeed fire with out the trigger being pulled or the hammer being cocked.

      From my understanding, the hammer rests against the firing pin when it is down, meaning sufficent force applied will transfer through the hammer, into the firing pin, and into the primer of the cartridge.

      This is why all cowboys and floks with a bit of sense would carry five shots, not six, and would carry with the hammer down on an empty chamber.

      So it is entirley possible that the revolver did discharge when it was dropped.

      To be fair, though, Ruger has been offering to install a transfer bar in their guns for decades.

      1. avatar Dyspeptic Gunsmith says:

        Ruger still will install the upgrade to a transfer bar mechanism free of charge. All you have to do is pay shipping of your revolver(s) there and back. Ruger will even supply you with the box.

        To encourage owners to upgrade, Ruger will not perform service work on the “Old Model” revolvers unless/until the upgrade is installed.

        Ruger really couldn’t make the offer much more generous.

  4. avatar Kuli1911 says:

    Do we know if it was a single action revolver? Or just the report of a “western” looking gun?

  5. avatar ST says:

    Rule #5
    Keep your finger off the piece entirely when taking a dump.Boredom+Pistol=one exciting bathroom visit.

    As to the disposition of the weapon during a stall visit,sit with the holstered piece facing the wall in the farthest corner of the restroom.And for the love of every pretty girl in the world don’t dare play with it.You wouldn’t pull your concealed carry piece out in line at WalMart to fondle it ,so what makes a public bathroom any different?

  6. avatar Chris Dumm says:

    Another hypothesis: since the report describes a ‘cowboy-style’ revolver, I suspect he was carrying an older non-transfer bar Colt SAA clone, and forgot to load only five beans in the wheel. The Ruger New Model Blackhawk was the first single-action revolver that could be safely carried with a live round under the hammer; all Peacemakers before it were actually five-shooters.

    Toilet carry is a real challenge. My old (and completely worn-out) tuckable belly band holster did a great job of securing my handgun while I ‘dropped trou’, but my new K-Holster starts to sag Earthward as soon as I loosen my belt.

    Farago and I have been discussing possible solutions to this problem for more than a year.

    1. avatar Dyspeptic Gunsmith says:

      That’s what it sounds like to me. It takes very little for a SAA or clone to land on it’s hammer and light off a round under the hammer.

    2. avatar I_Like_Pie says:

      This is what happened. He is a Ruger afficinado living near prescott with a couple of old three screw Rugers.

      The rule is…Load one, skip one, and load five. When you rest the hammer is should have been on an empty chamber.

      This guy obviously forgot that or never thought that he would ever drop the gun. Even if he didn’t drop the gun he dropped trou with the gun strapped to it. Same end result. Glad nobody was hurt.

  7. avatar Evan says:

    Simple. Unless you have one of those clip free holsters like a Remora, leave it on. Don’t drop the pants below your knees. Keep the waistband above the knees and push your legs out a little to keep it all from hanging. If you have to fasten the belt to keep it from drooping, do so. If your holster won’t retain the gun, get a different holster. The side benefit is your pants/skirt aren’t piled up on the dirty floor.

    Just as there’s a stop-touching-it/don’t-mess-with-it rule, there is a don’t-take-it-off unless-your-using-it-or-locking-it-up-rule.

  8. avatar Drew says:

    Is this an issue for some folks? I use IWB’s and my gun just hangs there behind my left calf in the upright position. Ya’ll must use some really clean bathrooms if you puddle your trousers on the deck.

  9. avatar HAVE GUN says:

    Be it #2 in the stall, or trying on clothes, my biggest concern has always been to not leave my weapon behind (so to speak.)

    Seems I always find a way to place my weapon somewhere, not on the floor or on the coat hanger.

    1. avatar Evan says:

      If you’re trying pants or shorts, leave the holster, gun and pants all connected and set them on the bench or seat. You are,/i> going to leave the changing room in your pants, no? Leave ’em together and you are not going to leave the gun behind.

  10. avatar Joe says:

    The only Ruger single action that could go off by being dropped would be either an old Flattop or 3-Screw Ruger Blackhawk, both grand old revolvers that haven’t been made for at least 40 years, and I can’t mentally bring myself to picture one hitting the floor of a skanky Walmart public restroom. (The horror….)

    Dude should go to jail for that alone, much less endangering others and clearly being a reckless goofball.

  11. avatar Tom says:

    and began to sit down when his Ruger .357-caliber Western-style revolver fell out of its holster and fired a round,
    Did this have the transfer bar?

  12. avatar Mogg says:

    This is one area where shoulder holsters really shine.
    Seated access to your weapon be it in a car, or on the can is made so much easier
    by a good shoulder holster.

    1. avatar Ralph says:

      Every shoulder holster I’ve ever worn has felt like an instrument of torture.

      1. avatar "Dr." Dave says:

        They’re also an instrument for flagging yourself and every other human being 180 degrees in front of you when you draw under stress.

        1. avatar John says:

          What about an ankle holster?

  13. avatar MadDawg J says:

    I blame Dan Zimmerman and the rest of TTAG for this. After all he was just doing his impression of http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2012/02/daniel-zimmerman/weekend-photo-caption-contest-25/

  14. avatar pcrh says:

    It disturbes me that we have so many candidates for the IGOotD. Seems like it happens almost…daily. Hoping I’m never one.

  15. avatar tdubb says:

    Nothing like a news story to help perpetuate a little gun fear.

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