The name says it all. The H&R Pardner Pump Protector wasn’t built for wing-shooting doves or busting clay pigeons. No, this is a gun to be kept at the bedside, ready for behavior modification on bad people who want to go bump in the night. Loaded with up to six rounds of 2 ¾” or 3” shot, its twelve gauge bite is even worse than its thunderous bark, and that says a lot.
This H&R shotty is crafted in China by Qiqihar Hawk Industries Co., Ltd., a subsidiary of China North Industries Corporation. Commonly referred to as Norinco, most gun fanciers know China North Industries as a major producer of inexpensive SKS and AK-pattern rifles. Hawk confines itself to making shotguns, including a slew of clones of the classic Remington 870 sold under the H&R name.
Oh, and H&R is an affiliate of Remington, which is part of the Freedom Group, which is owned by Cerberus Capital Management. Got that? Thus, the H&R/Hawk alliance reflects the modern era where money-loving American capitalists and money-grubbing Chinese communists come together like lions and lambs to sing “Cumbayá” and peddle inexpensive defensive firearms to a grateful American public. The deal twixt the two companies might not be Mao Zedong’s idea of a Great Leap Forward, but the rest of us can enjoy one of the fruits of this cross-cultural incest: the H&R Pardner Pump Protector.
First Impressions
Anyone who is looking for class and style is advised to go elsewhere. Those seeking a robust, quality-built shotgun have come to the right place.
The Protector arrives in a lovely corrugated cardboard box, and that’s as fancy as things are going to get. The gun nestling in contoured packing foam is matte black, except for the dab of gold at the sight. It’s a menacing-looking piece. At first fondle you know this is a heavy gun, built like the proverbial tank. Maybe from tanks; it feels as if it’s made from milsurp Type 59s.
The Pardner Pump Protector’s machined extractor is large and ruggedly constructed. It positively engages the rim of the shotshell. Since a broken extractor can make self-defense problematic, a strong one is a real good thing.
While there are tooling marks inside the chamber, the ejector is smooth and well-constructed. Overbuilt. Whenever you fire a pump action shotgun, the ejector and extractor are doing their thing. If those two relatively small parts are rugged, the odds are good that the shotgun will remain serviceable for a long time. Such is the case with the Pardner Pump.
The synthetic fore-end rides on rigid twin steel rails. The steel trigger guard is hefty, but it’s not contoured for a gloved finger, reinforcing the notion that the Protector is no deer-shooting slug gun. The barrel is thick enough that it would take many thousands of dollars rounds to shoot it out.
Even the Pardner Pump’s plastic has the feel of quality. The synthetic stock and fore-end seem dense and strong. I didn’t test the stock with a hammer, but it’s clear that some Chinese engineer with a degree from UCLA made this shotgun to take punishment. Altogether, the Protector seems heavier than its claimed weight, but sure enough it measures at its listed 7.5 lbs. on my made-in-China scale.
Weight aside, the H&R 1871′s balance is just about perfect for its intended use. Its balance point is just forward of the trigger guard, where it should be. The Protector comes to shoulder naturally and swings readily from side to side, as well as up and down, and points very well. The Protector’s 18.5” barrel is short enough to make the shotgun fairly handy in close quarters, although it would not be the right tool for a gunfight in a phone booth.
Looking down the barrel of the Protector is an unnerving experience. A full cylinder shotgun, the P³ has no choke tube, so the muzzle looks about as big around as the Channel Tunnel and scarier than a dragon’s cave. Shouldering the P³ puts the shooter on the right side of the tunnel and the bad guy on the wrong side, which should imbue the owner with a feeling of confidence and the bad guy with a serious case of the yips.
If guns are supposed to be comforting and not comfortable, then the Pardner Pump Protector is the cover boy for comforting.
Shooting the Protector
If stealth was the goal, then the P³ is an epic fail. It’s about as quiet as a jackhammer. Just pumping it produces more decibels than your average Metallica concert. Racking the P³ is so raucous I suspect it was tuned by someone familiar with the term “stack of Marshalls.”
I think the notion that a home invader can be compelled to brown trow by the mere sound of a shotgun being racked is an urban myth. More likely, the average home invader is expecting an easy mark slumbering insensate between a down comforter and the Ninth Circle of Consciousness.
Greeted instead by a wide-awake homeowner wielding a noisemaker, even the dopiest doped-up bad guy is capable of making a well-reasoned decision to leave the premises and screw with someone else. I confess, however, that if I was a bad guy creeping into someone’s home on little cat feet and I heard this shotgun being pumped, I would exeunt, stage right, so fast that I’d leave a contrail.
Racking the gun didn’t require the use of ear protection, but firing the beast was a whole different kettle of noise. It’s the loudest twelve gauge I’ve ever fired. I’m used to heads swiveling around at the range when firing a Mosin Nagant M44 carbine, but not when shooting a modern shotgun.
The P³’s sonic boom might be a positive considering the gun’s defensive function, but a negative considering that most people don’t wear their ProMag electronic earmuffies when they don their footsy pajamas. Anyone who intends to shoot this gun indoors without adequate soundproofing covering his auditory organs should learn American Sign Language immediately and forthwith.
And then there’s the recoil.
All twelve gauge shotguns kick. Some kick harder than others. This one kicks like an angry jackass with hemorrhoids. The P³’s spongy perforated rubber buttpad looks great and moderates the recoil somewhat, but shooting this gun requires the operator to pay attention and really pull the gun tightly into the shoulder. Otherwise, it will leave a mark. Fortunately, most of the recoil is straight back and muzzle rise is controllable for follow-up shots, in the absurdly unlikely event that another blast of twelve gauge persuasion might be required.
The PPP is chambered for 2 ¾” and 3” shells. To test the ability of the Pardner to pump a variety of shells, I loaded the five shot magazine with a mix of 2 ¾ and 3” shells at random, consisting of both slugs and 00 buck. Each shell needed to be pressed into the tube until it clicked, indicating that it had found a welcome home. I racked the pump to chamber a round, and topped off the magazine. Then I let one fly.
Trying to create a jam, I babied the pump after the first shot. Sure enough, this rugged shotgun does not take well to a feathery touch. Simply stated, this ain’t no Benelli. The action doesn’t go snick-snick, but it loves to go whack-whack. Pumped hard, as one is apt to do when energized by fear and adrenaline, the P³ functioned flawlessly, time after time.
Accuracy? At home-defense distances, this shotgun will turn a bad guy’s man suit into Hunan shredded beef rather quickly. I wouldn’t take it on a snipe hunt, but for persuading an evildoer to see the error of his ways and get right with the universe, this gun rules.
After sending several magazine-loads downrange, my shoulder began to insist that discretion was the better part of bursitis. Remembering Scarlett O’Hara’s plaintive last line in “Gone With the Wind,” I called it a day after running through about 50 rounds.
Conclusion
I’ve never been a big fan of Chinese products. Between slathering baby toys with lead paint and seasoning our pets’ food with poisonous melamine, Chinese industry has done nothing to raise my confidence level. Until now.
The Pardner Pump Protector is one tough-ass shotgun, built to last and cheap to buy. Sold under the H&R, NEF and Norinco brand names, the P³ has a decade-long history in the US, almost all of it extremely favorable. While those who don’t own a Pardner Pump may abjure the very thought of a Chinese shotgun, them that owns ‘em loves ‘em. Most of all, unlike so many Chinese products that kill owners and animals through negligence, the Pardner Pump Protector might actually save my life on purpose.
While the list price of the P³ is a whopping $240 or thereabouts, the street price of this home improvement power tool is closer to $159 at Dick’s and other chain stores. Used guns can sell for $100 or less. And since black goes well with green, the Protector will dress up a room as neatly as the money it saves will dress up a wallet. For a real, no frills home protection shotgun, look no further than H&R’s Pardner Pump Protector.
SPECIFICATIONS
Model: H&R 1871 Pardner Pump Protector
Caliber: 12 Gauge
Ammunition capacity: 5+1 (2 ¾” or 3” shells)
Materials: High carbon steel barrel and receiver. Black synthetic stock with grooved fore-end, ventilated recoil pad and swivel studs.
Weight empty: 7.5 pounds
Barrel Length: 18.5″
Overall length: 37 5/8″
Sights: Bead front; drilled and tapped for scope base
Action: Pump
Finish: Matte black
Price: $240 msrp (approx.)
RATINGS (out of five stars)
Style * *
I tried to be objective with the style rating. Subjectively, I love the lack of style and I’d rate the Pardner Pump Protector as a * * * * ½ out of five. It compares very favorably to a well-designed tractor. It looks about as purposeful a tractor, it’s as noisy as a tractor, it’s as tough as a tractor and with a little TLC will probably outrun a Deere. That’s my kind of style.
Ergonomics (carry) * * *
It feels like a heavy shotgun, but balances perfectly. Since the Protector was meant to be carried from one’s bedroom to one’s front door and maybe up a flight of stairs, its avoirdupois isn’t an issue.
Ergonomics (firing) * * * *
The 14 ¼” length of pull suited me just fine. Petite ladies, men with alligator arms or NBA rebounding all-stars might feel differently. The pistol grip is comfortable and correctly angled. The gun points and sights very well. The trigger is as light and smooth as Chinese farm implement technology can make it. Recoil is a bitch or this would be a five star shooter.
Reliability * * * * *
It handled a mix of 2 ¾” and 3” shotshells, both buckshot and slugs, without a hiccup. Rack the pump like you mean it and the Pardner Pump Protector will feed as rapidly as pack of hungry hound dogs with tapeworms.
Customize This * * * *
It’s drilled and tapped for the mount and sight combination of your choice. Because it’s a Remington 870 clone, it accepts most aftermarket Remmy stuff except for Remington barrels, which are not compatible. But why customize anything? The Pardner Pump is perfect for what it is, exactly as it is.
OVERALL RATING * * * *
Cheap, powerful and reliable, it’s the quintessential bedside shotgun and a damn good warclub to boot. Get one. Hell, for the price of a Remington 870, you can double down on Pardner Pumps and snag some ammo, too.
You down with PPP? Yeah, you know me!
Well I would prefer American made however y’all can tal quality and perfection bla bla bla all day long. If $179 is what it costs to protect my family I’m in. It only has to work for one or two shots AT THE MOST! Hell ill buy another
I’m sorry, I do not like Chinese firearms, no matter how good the reviews are. I DO, however, like Chinese food.
The food can kill ya just as dead as the gun.
Look dude, China has made some of the best AK-47s to ever exist. Writing this gun off because it’s Chinese is just ignorant.
More for me I love my sks and ppp.
You should do a review of the Hungarian built PA-63 pistol.
I would, but they’re illegal in Massachusetts. Then again, what isn’t?
Why are they illegal? They only hold seven.
They are illegal under the AG’s “safety” regulations, not under the AWB law. I can own a PA-63, but can’t buy one from a dealer. A person-to-person transfer would most likely be legal.
Well, dernit. I’m glad I live in Bama.
I got a Benelli M90 last summer, extended mag version, and it’s also a usable deer gun. But it’s a sweet home defense gun. I had a Mossberg Maverick 88 a few years ago and it was a POS. For 179 dollars I could have done better with a used 870 Rem. Generally I’ve stayed away from cheap shotguns ever since, the 870 is about as inexpensive as I’ll go only because Remington has perfected it over 40 years.
I wonder if today’s 870 is as rugged as yesteryear’s.
I think so. I’ve used one in the woods for a few years and it’s been troublefree, the finish is darn good and the internals are still rugged.
I have a Mossberg clone (a Western made for Montgomery Ward’s). Love it.
Mine too. $75 at a gun show in uber-liberal Boulder, Colorado. Those days are gone.
I appreciate shotguns for home defense roles, But, my Mossy comes in at slightly under 3 bills on sale with two barrels. From a fit and finish stand point its better with wood furniture. Made in the US also holds weight with me. As far as dependability only issue I’ve ever had was a bad primer in one shell out of something in the thousands range.
+1
“Made in the US also holds weight with me.”
Not me. Made in the US almost always stands for “Lower quality at a higher price”.
“Lower quality at a higher price.”
Sadly, that statement gets truer every year.
For curiosity, can you please point out a few examples? I’m still working on my “gift list” (not just for the holidays) and have yet to run across something made better overseas than a similar model made here in the USA. Like I said before, there are some exceptions (cars, electronics, etc), but are outside the realm of what I consider a “gift”.
So by “gift” I assume you mean “gun” (and if so, why not just say so? It’s a gun blog, you don’t need euphemisms here). Give that I’ve been shooting for less than a year, I’m far from an expert. However, I own guns from Poland, Russia, Brazil, Argentina, and the US. While, for guns, the “lower quality at a higher price” may not always be true, the higher price almost definitely is. Guns I’ve purchased from other countries have been just as good as their American counterparts, but at a fraction of the cost.
It always amuses me that the US was built and thrived due to capitalism (buying from the person who provides the best product at the best price) and yet today we see so much anti-capitalist rhetoric because of people upset that other countries can do just as good of a job (or better) for a significantly lower cost.
I really disagree with your assessment, what kind of guns are you comparing to come up with this?
No, by gift I meant a gift. As a writer for TTAG, I don’t have any issues with the word gun… or firearm, or boom-stick, or bang-thingy, etc. I put gift in quotation marks, because some “gifts” are gifts to myself
Telling my wife that I want a S&W Performance Center 6″ 629 with rosewood grips must be to her what Charlie Brown’s teacher is like to Chuck.
No one has yet to provide any empirical evidence to support the “made in USA = crap” argument. Even your reply about guns made overseas are of better quality has no examples. Seeing that you have been a shooter for less than a year, I can only assume that you’ve been doing lots of reading online to make such assumptions. By the selection of countries that you’ve picked, I will also go as far as to assume that you’re referring to military weapons. If that is the case (and if it is just say so), then I feel that you have lots more reading to do (and shooting for that matter). I can name very few guns made overseas that don’t have a comparable equivalent (or better made) counter-example from the United States.
I disagree for the most part – as a matter of fact, check out my Holiday Guild here on TTAG. I spent a good amount of time researching Christmas and Holiday gifts this year. This year alone I found over 2 dozen gifts (for me and others) that are top quality and are made here in the USA. Gerber knives, Kershaw, and many other companies have USA made and Chinese made lines. I have found (and tested… keep an eye out under our Gear Review section) that the USA made equipment is FAR superior than those from China. Of course, this doesn’t apply to everything (like electronics, cars, etc).
I’ve had a Kershaw for 30 years and it’s still so sharp that I can shave with it, though it’s Asian made.
I will point out that “Asian made” and “Chinese made” are not one in the same, particularly nowadays. I own a cheap, Chinese made “Buck” knife that is covered in blood and fish guts. I occassionally rinse it in the lake, but haven’t “cleaned it” in forever (actually, I don’t think I ever really cleaned it in the decade that I’ve had it). It is still sharp, razor sharp actually. However, if I were running through the desert in a survival situation, it would be the last knife I would grab (with the exception of using it for shaving).
The problem as I see it is not so much quality as it is the way American companies are swindling Americans by selling Chinese products at twice the price simply because they carry an American brand. Practically all companies, if not all, do it ( and not just American ).
Ex. I purchased a pair of Harley -Davidson boots on line at the best price I could find (onlinebootstore.com $129.99). I also bought a pair of Xelement boots (leatherup.com $65.00). Both appear to be of equally good quality, are comfortable, fit well and remain in good condition. In fact you could easily switch brands and notice no difference. Both pair are made in China.
Now the last time I checked China was a communist country. I believe communist factories are government run with government employees using government owned materials and equipment. Therefore does it not seem logical that both pair of boots were made in the same type of factory? Made from the same materials? Made by the same government trained employees? Using the same government owned equipment? Possibly in the exact same factory?
So why does one pair cost exactly twice as much as the other? Maybe the H.D. boots will wear twice as long but I’m not counting on it.
Unfortunately this practice is very,very far from the exception and very,very much the rule.
“Now the last time I checked China was a communist country. I believe communist factories are government run with government employees using government owned materials and equipment.”
Actually, China is no longer a “communist” country in the traditional Soviet sense, and has evolved greatly since Mao’s death in the 1970s. It’s very difficult to pin down exactly what China is, because of its uniqueness. Some people have coined the term “state capitalist” to describe it. While there are state-owned corporations (particularly in fields such as auto, energy, steel, and defense), most corporations in China are privately held. Obviously, it still has its fair share of Mega-conglomorates such as Norinco, but even these companies are adopting western / Japanese -style business models.
Hi Joe,
Yes you are correct about China evolving . In the very late 70′s, around 78,79 if memory serves, China implemented a market-based economic system. Since then China has prospered greatly. I believe at present it is the largest exporter of goods on earth. Probably not surprising to anyone. I also believe it is the worlds largest importer. Again, given the large population, not to surprising. By the way I have heard it is illeagl for a couple in China to have more than one child. Do you know anything about this? Also I believe China now is second only to the U.S. in economic power while enjoying the fastest economic growth.
I use the word “believe” a lot because long ago I decided to refrain from stating flatly that something is or is not.
I was unaware that private ownership had been granted in China. If that is the case purhaps I will cut H-D a little slack, but very little.
I believe (again) that China is still a single party state governed by a body which calls itself the Communist Party of China. To me this makes China a communist country, purhaps not in the traditonial Soviet sense.
Joe, I do know how to spell perhaps. Don’t know how I could have missed it twice. Also I know the difference between to and too. By the way I have a bad habit of hitting the wrong key, especially y instead of t. I do it consyanyly. So if you notice any other mistakes lets keep them between us. I had to take an important phone call and was unable to review or I would have cleaned it up for you.
The rear of the receiver has a pretty distinct Browning profile. The Chicoms wouldn’t steal another manufacturers design would they?
The article says “it’s a Remington 870 clone”. And plenty of American companies steal each others designs, look at Ruger copying Kel-Tec, or any AR manufacturer outside of Armalite.
This was my first shotgun, and I still have it in my gun safe. Fantastic review of a great gun, good job!
Great review Ralph! Good job. I’ve seen the P3′s while entertaining myself endlessly flipping through Pages-O’-Bud’s. Wouldn’t have guessed it would garner this positive an assessment.
Close to, but not a real Remington 870 clone. Dug my 870 out of the corner to compare. The reciever hump does not exist on an 870 as it does on the PPP. Heck, just get a used 870 laying in the back of the gun store. Right now, a lot of used shot guns are crying for a home.
Correct. The different shape of the receiver is why Remmy barrels are not compatible with the PPP or vice versa. Neither is the Remmy mag extension. A lot of other parts, including aftermarket stocks, can be swapped back and forth between the 870 and the PPP.
I’m sure agreements were signed to keep the barrels incompatible.
Norinco does (or at least did) have this same sg with the rounded 870 receiver profile. That model also comes with ghost ring sights – a very nice set actually. I have one and from what I can tell every parts – except for the barrel – is interchangeable w 870 parts.
Not to get into a political/economic discussion, but if one’s reluctant to purchase a chicom product primarily because of the economic impact on our US economy, well you might want to read Thomas Sowell’s “Basic Economics.”
You don’t even have to read, there are a bunch of Tom Sowell interviews on youtube. Economics is not something to be directed by philosophy, it never works. You can shout BUY AMERICAN all you want but when it comes down to it people will seek the best value without regard to the location of manufacture. If you want to solve the ethical problems of unfair trade and slave labor then you can require that our government only allow the importation of items whose manufacturer abides by our labor, wage, and environmental laws.
being recoil sensetive i think its too bad its not available in 20 ga.
You might want to try Federal Power-Shok low recoil ammunition. 12 gauge 2-3/4″ 00 buckshot is $5.79 at Midway for a box of 5. I haven’t tried it myself, but I’m going to. Rumor has it that this shell patterns very tightly at SD distances.
american, yes, german yes, italian yes, chinese, ah hell no way!!!
I appreciate a tough, low cost shotgun, but China? You lost me at China… + 1 on what a Joe above says…
I bought one of these for my dad last week. The local sporting goods store had a $129 Black Friday sale on them.
I’ve got of these and think it’s one of the best gun bargains I’ve ever made. Very reliable and rugged. I haven’t noticed the recoil, but I’ve only fired field/target loads in it so far. If you aren’t asleep and get on the bird before it gets out of range, this gun will do an acceptable job on skeet. I didn’t get one as cheap as Sean did, but I paid less for the gun, including tax, than I would for a spare barrel for my Remington 11-87.
I just finished the 4-day tactical shotgun course at Frontsight in Pahrump, NV. I used a Remington 870 built on a Sportsman receiver by me to Remington’s Police line standard. During the build, I dehorned the receiver, so I suffered no cut fingers during the several hundred rounds loaded and fired during the course. The student I shot next to most during the course used a Chinese-made 970 clone with a NORINCO rollmark. The sharp edges on its receiver did cut his fingers as he loaded the shotgun. Other than that fault, the shotgun performed every bit as well as my Remington. It was accurate, smooth, reliable, and easy to operate. Because the course pushes tactical and emergency reloading practice, we seldom ever loaded more than three rounds at a time, so the lack of a magazine extension was of no consequence, as it really is not on the street, either. Knowing how to run a shotgun eliminates the need for high-capacity capability. I was so impressed with what I saw out of the Chinese-made shotgun that I am considering getting one for my next-to-bed weapon.
Pass. I have nothing against guns made across the ocean(s), but I will never have one in my safe that says “Made in China”. Ever.
A real honest POS! Crafted by slave labor, but I guess a 8 year old chinee needs a job too. Nice brazing for the action bars, my cat could do better. weighs about twice a 870.
Buy USA made – stop funding the chinee to turn around and buy the latest tech weapons, we’ll have to pay taxes for, to defend ourselves from. Stop supporting traitorous american management who ship jobs to our future enemy while they steal technology, patents, jobs
I think this would be the first time that I would support one of the editors deleting a comment. This is nothing but ignorant, xenophobic / racist trolling.
I can not agree with your suggestion to censor john’s comments. While I cannot address his reason or reasoning,they are not based on ignorance.
In 1978 China implimented vast economic reforms. At present China is the world’s second largest economy ( behind only the U.S.). It is the world’s fastest growing major economy.The largest exporter and second largest importer of goods. China is a recognized nuclear power. It has the world’s largest standing army and second largest defense budget. It has a successful space program. During the so called “Cold War “era many analysts predicted the next major war to be not between the U.S. and the U.S.S.R. but U.S. / U.S.S.R. vs China. These facts plus overpopulation and a vastly different political ideology make future conflict a very real possibilty. Americans do suffer unemploment due to outsourcing.
The problem with trying to buy American is the vast amount of products produced in China. It is virtually impossible to shop on a daily basis and get what you want/need without buying Chinese.It is near Christmas, how many toys have you purchased from Hasbro/ Matel not produced in China? If something is “made in America” what about the parts used to assemble it.
The only thing practical is to buy the things we want/need, try to buy American as often as possible and be content in the knowledge we have done our best.
Buying and enjoying new or surplus arms from Europe is not the same as buying from China, whose government openly flouts their hostility to virtually ever single positive element of our domestic and foreign policy (“positive” leaves out everything that Øbowmao and Abu Hillary are pushing).
The facts are that the Chinese DO steal our technology and our jobs.
I don’t condemn TTAG’s right to review chicom weapons, but I certainly won’t stand for censoring a reader who makes viable and truthful criticism about the manufacturers.
Chinese steal our technology, yes, but they do not “steal” our jobs – they merely are willing to work for less nominal pay (nominal and real wages are very different things), which is partly due to Americans thinking that doing something as basic as unskilled manual labor should provide a $60,000 + salary – which is just absurd.
Whether or not China steals technology (and you don’t think the US government does it too?) has nothing to do with if this is a decent gun or not. It’s just a great example of the very heart of capitalism – someone making an equally good product for less money.
“Chinese steal our technology, yes, but they do not “steal” our jobs – they merely are willing to work for less nominal pay (nominal and real wages are very different things), which is partly due to Americans thinking that doing something as basic as unskilled manual labor should provide a $60,000 + salary – which is just absurd.”
Nothing like slave labor, eh? (lets agree the UAW killed Detroit, and move on from the Chinese shooting anyone who organizes a strike in a factory and then charging their family for the bullet).
“Whether or not China steals technology”
You are in doubt? Are you even IN America?
“(and you don’t think the US government does it too?)”
I’ll ask in a different manner. ARE YOU ACTUALLY AN AMERICAN?
Are you one of those Øbomanurists who thinks “American exceptionalism” is passe?
You are actually comparing the ongoing RAMPANT and world-wide theft of industrial technology BY THE CHINESE GOVT with what either the U.S. Govt or American private enterprise does?
” has nothing to do with if this is a decent gun or not. It’s just a great example of the very heart of capitalism – someone making an equally good product for less money.”
Yeah, using near-slave labor and taking the profits from it to DESTROY OUR ALLIES AND EVENTUALLY OUR WAY OF LIFE.
I am sure you sleep very well at night, having no conscience.
“Slave labor” by your terms, not theirs. People like you who don’t understand different living circumstances in other countries call things “slave labor” that the people who actually live there call “a great job”. Yes, some places in China suck, but many (if not all) of those “horrible factories” are far better than the alternatives. Your thinking is the same blind ideology that caused Starkist to be forced to close down plants in poor Asian countries that had been paying three times the average wage in those countries. Were those people better off with a mandated minimum wage that caused the plant to close or when they were making less than you thought they should but three times more than their fellow countryman with similar education and skills?
Try reading the full sentence – I said whether or not they do steal corporate secrets / technology has nothing to do with if this gun is a quality gun or not.
Your blind religious devotion to a corrupt government has nothing to do with the issue at hand (whether or not this gun is reliable and well made, especially for the bargain price). I think your delusions that the US can do no wrong and that “Americans” are naturally superior (I seem to remember someone starting a war and a mass murder campaign revolving around the idea that his countrymen were naturally superior to others) are passe and childish. They are the result of a lack of critical thinking, not of looking at all of the information and making an informed decision.
I like how you think it’s OK for US companies to copy / steal from other firms and fr the US government to steal and spy at will, but not China because well, they’re Chinese, so they’re obviously inferior and should be treated as such. Racism is the exact opposite of rational thought. It’s what people who can’t come up with a good argument rely on (hence why you so often see Obamanites call anyone who disagrees with the “messiah” a racist).
Yes, because paying people a better wage than they’d earn working on a farm is “slave labor”. I’m sure someone as educated and enlightened as yourself is well aware that the typical factory worker in China has seen their real wages more than double over the last decade – but apparently receiving large raises is “slave labor”. The fact is that they realize that unskilled labor is just that – UNSKILLED and is literally a dime a dozen (in any part of the world). Xenophobic American’s like yourself cling to this foolish idea that because of where you’re born means that you can have no education and be entitled to a large income – and then you wonder why unskilled jobs are going elsewhere to countries that don’t have the arrogance and sense of entitlement – people who understand the concept of WORKING for a living.
When in recent history has China attacked any of our allies? Why the frak should we care what happens between China and our allies even if they did? It’s not our business what two other countries do between each other as long as they’re not harming us. You’re just as foolish as the people demanding that we invade the whole world to kill the “evil commies” 60 years ago.
I pity you.
$119.00 at a local Dicks Sporting Goods several months back. Couldn’t pass it up. Expected to get what I paid for and was stunned at the overall solidity of the firearm.
Now it tends to be what I grab first (even over my FN TPS) for no other reason that it is utterly straightforward and utilitarian. Less buttons/dials/knobs/readouts/lights/death-ray-beams can be a huge plus.
Haha, I’m not sure if anyone saw this or not, but I just noticed that the box has a section titled “Mr Dealer”… the only thing better would be “Dealer-san”… oh, the years of working for a Japanese company were great, but I’m glad I can still enjoy all of the little “lost in translations”.
This unfortunately has turned from an informative gun review into a political and economics discussion.
Unfortunately? That’s what I love about TTAG.
I’m still leaning toward the cheapo Mossberg 500, 8 in the tube. Also, I think I might go 20ga. Does the job (more than any reasonable handgun), a lot less flash, bang, and kick in the middle of the night. I’m sure various experts agree, but I can’t cite them offhand.
As for all the cheap commie labor disputes, that’s a tough one. China, like the U.S., is aligning itself much more along classic fascist lines (corporate/state collusion).
I’ll throw this grenade:
One Big Union!
I bought one of these for home protection (on a tight budget). I really wasn’t expecting much, but the first few rounds turned out to be a pleasant surprise. The P3 is a bit of an anvil, but it works surprisingly well. No argument on the “kicks like a mule” statement – it does. I actually looked for a used 870, but ended up with some Dick’s gift certificates so the P3 followed me home.
For a field gun I would look for something different, something more refined, but for a wall leaner that is dedicated to mitigating two-legged skunks the P3 will work just fine.
I own the pardner pump in a 28″ I use it for every hunting season yes it does kick but to me not as bad as 870.When using 3″oo it patterns better than most shotguns i’ve owned with a mod choke and round half the money.I actually dropped in 2′ of yesterday duck hunting and still works flawlessly.maybe china made but it is my go to gun. thanks for reading my opinion
I have been handed down a Remington Model 11 made in 1927 from my grandfather when he passed in 1986… It in it’s self is a tank shotgun… Police riot barrel and a 31 feild barrel… This Christmas I though since I learned as a kid to shoot and take care of it to it’s shooting life still today, that I should do the same for my two sons… Being a first shotgun for them I wasn’t going to drop hundreds to Thousands for a shotgun.. I did research on many guns out their, Remington 870, Mossy 500′s etc…Though I love only American made products including guns, I came to find out that in the 70″s some Remingtons were made in Japan and other brands elsewhere… I found that the H&R 1871 Pardner 12 gauge pump, though made in China, it was a tooled animal not cast…Many Military men who served knew alot more about tough weapons and they tested this guns toughness and found it to be the best buy out there.. They called it a tank made gun… The field testers tested the Pardner vs the Mavrick 88 and found the 88 a weaker more likely to fail gun over the Pardners well built gun…So the writing on the wall was too clear… For a first , second or third gun, the H&R Pardner 1871 12 gauge pump was to way to go…. For the price of two guns , 500 rounds of shells and two boxes of clays, was just slightly more then buying a 870 or a mossy 500 only… It’s a well made gun over anything else from China, so I can’t complain…. A best Buy weapon…
Bought my pardner,it worked great with2&3/4 shells but would hang on 3″ was long time before I noticed this but the gun comes with a 5 yr limited warranty.The store I bought it at made a few phone calls about it and told me it was covered under warranty then sent it in to Remington for repair with no hassle whatsoever that is a plus and makes me think this was a good purchase as they will stand behind their guarentee-with no cost to me for shipping or anything pretty good for a firearm costing under 200 bucks
Hey Guys – IT’S MADE IN CHINA!!! I don’t care what BS excuses you use to justify your purchase -IT’S STILL MADE IN CHINA. Buy a Remington, buy a Mossberg, buy a used gun, there are millions of great used guns to choose from. Don’t buy a gun MADE IN CHINA! Anyone who would buy this commie junk probably does all their shopping at chinamart -er I mean walmart, BUY AMERICAN!!
Remington Owen the compmany they brought them back in 2007. Look at your gun I bet the part are made in china.
Really? I bet half the shit you own is made some where other then the US and you don’t even know. Stop living in the past.
I owned one of these for 5 years before I replaced it with a Mossberg 500. I’ve got to say, for $170 it was barely worth it, especially compared to the Maverick 88 I should have gotten instead. The steel on this bad boy was pretty cheap–very inclined to rust. Also the pump would jam up at least once every 25 rounds and would require some pretty violent movements from me.
At the time it was the only thing I could afford, so the odd tendency for the bad boy to shoot a foot to the left at 15 yards didn’t bother me too much. Since then I saved up and got a good American made 500 that is lighter, more accurate, and doesn’t jam up if babied. A door gun will probably be used if you’re tired, therefore not able to clear a jammed pump as easy. And once again, you don’t need almost 8 pounds of Chinese steel for something that will probably never get dropped.
I own two Remington 870 Expresses and when comparing the H&R Pardner to them, I believe the Pardner is equivalent or, in some cases, superior to the 870. It is a gun that will not disappoint. To smooth things out, I did rack it 1000 times (without pulling the trigger), then disassembled for thorough cleaning. Much smoother now.
First reply is to the whiner who keeps chanting MADE IN CHINA.. Your Remingtons, Marlins, H&R Pardner Pumps, Bushmaster and many others are made from the same company who owns all those I just listed so get off your made in America High Horse…The Mavrick 88 is assembled in America but with parts made in Mexico not American parts… The Pardner Pump I said is a well made gun that doesn’t cost $300 to $1500 dollars… It’s a gun to shoot with in any weather and not worry if the fancy stock or receiver gets a ding… I now have 3 of these Pardner 12 gauge pumps, one for myself, and one for each of my son’s.. As for rusting? I guess it may at some point happen but these guns have so much protection on them from shipping, I have yet to see a speck of rust yet… As for those who are whining on made in America, think again about all the Remingtons in the 70′s that were made in Japan and elsewhere, so drop the made in America Yak cause your apparently not doing your home work on the guns you own from the past…Myself and son’s have been shooting every weekend since they got theses guns for Christmas with no problems at all.. We clean them after every use and use Remoil to keep them oiled…I can’t say anything about 3″ shells cause we have not used them, just 2.75 shells…We have seen shooters at the range with your so called American high dollar guns have issues with jamming, yet we keep pounding down the clays at ease…Overall I’m saying the gun is tough, shoots great and a great price for the money and unless I’m closing my eyes to shoot, I may miss… It’s not a show gun that will make you flip out if you scratch it… It’s made in China, so what, Your car is made in Japan or elsewhere along with your HD tv and 90% of everything in your house, you can’t buy a HD TV or most other things made in the USA cause China makes them…If you got the money to blow, buy the high dollar guns I don’t care… If you want a well made gun that with care like any other gun needs, the Pardner pump is the gun for you..Take a Remington 870 and a Pardner, place them side by side and you will see the metal work of the reciever and like parts are exactly the same.. The Stocks are the only difference and the 870 barrel wont inter change but H&R offers a barrel program for $55 if you want a shorter or long barrel, try getting different barrels for a 870, $300 .. I expect that there will always be haters of the 1871 Pardner 12 gauge pump, I’m fine with that… I’m happy with my 3 guns …
Remington’s made in Japan? Hmmm, which ones? Can you elaborate?
Browning A5′s in the 70′s, Japan…Remingtons too…Along with being made in Malaysia, Mexico,NewZealand, Singapore etc… So made in America isn’t totally true…So all these posting people on American made guns only my have one of those guns made in any of those countries…
To the Clown who said the gun shot a foot off, your just a bad shooter… We have target slug shot these Parners and they where on target at 40 yrd targets… maybe if we tried 50yrds or more the slugs may have been off some but they shoot very well, slugs or shot…Your Mossy isn’t that perfect, only in your mind…
PS, my posts are of the 1871 12 gauge Pardner pump with 28″ barrel, not the 18,5″… Just wanted to correct my earlier posts with the barrels…
I got one of these so called budget guns. I say so called, because if it does what I want from it at a fair price, what is wrong with that? Putting politics aside, I am happy with it so far AND this being my first gun, it may lead me into buying more expensive (so called better) guns in the future.
Nothing against this gun, I’ve never shot one, but the barrel issue is a deal breaker for me, that is the reason I love my 870 so much. While at home being a defense gun it has the 18″ police barrel with rifle sights on it (along with many other HD pieces) but when it’s time to go hunting or to the skeet range a couple of minutes and the appropriate barrel and stock are on it. Barrels can be found at most sporting goods stores and gun shops, and if you are paying $300 for a barrel (Paul from Texas) it better be engraved because the only one that costs that much new includes a bore sighted scope mounted on it. (http://www.cabelas.com/product/Remington-870-Replacement-Shotgun-Barrels/705659.uts?WTz_l=Header%3BSearch-All+Products but Mossberg makes one for the 879 for almost half) Barrels, complete 870s, stocks, etc. can usually be found used, often like new in box, in most areas where any sort of hunting takes place. Around here there is almost always someone selling an 870 in great shape for under $200. In my opinion it is the only shotgun I need because it is so versatile and can fill many roles.
Paul from Texas, the 28″ barrel probably helps out a lot with the accuracy. With that barrel it’s probably a pretty different gun. And as for the Made in China point, I try my best to avoid buying anything made in China, from my guns to my boots to my clothes to anything; and along the same lines I boycotted anything made by Remington and their parent company Freedom Group and Cerberus Capital Management.
Also on the Mossberg Maverick 88, I have nothing against giving money to legitimate businesses in our South neighbor. Under NAFTA we should do more of what Mossberg is willing to do.
Pingback: New England (HR) Pardner Pump
My dad is 82 and i am 54.
he just gave it to me “the protector” that he purchased a log time ago and he never shot.
How do I tell how old it is? he is loosing his memory etc.
Thank You Guys
Pingback: My Homepage
Pingback: Home defense shotgun advice - Page 2 - WaltherForums
i just went out and bought one because im dealing with some people and property. an email response would be nice. i might be using the wrong amo, i am not using buckshot or slug, but i can only fit 2 in the tube and one in the chamber. please email me if you can give me any advice. jtysseling@hotmail.com
J(army)
Screw the tube cap off, push down the plastic holder with your finger and turn it 1/4 turn (either direction) and let it up and out. Pull out the spring, remove the long plastic magazine plug then reassemble it all. Now you can get six in the tube and one in the chamber.
Pingback: WTT: 1871 Pardner Pump Protector - INGunOwners
Just bought one for home defense for my wife. This is one solid piece of noise, even the decibels of racking the slide is persuasion squared. Now to the farm to let her get used to being kicked by an angry mule with hemorrhoids…lol. Interested to see how controllable it is with the stock tucked under my arm.
My thoughts on this gun are that it is a serious, no frills, utilitarian of home protection.
Just bought a p3 today and am HIGHLY impressed! Don’t give 2 flips where it’s made, as long as it leaves a bad guy DRT!!
Just bought my first shotgun today. It was a 12 gauge h@r 1871, and no complaits from me, who cares who make it as long as it a good time whn you go shoot some rounds witg your family
As a licensed embalmer and former prison correctional officer, I must say that at a “moment of truth” when a bad guy is breaking into your castle in the middle of the night that I am hesitant to give two horse sh*t$ where my shotgun was made and how much it may have cost. I am also not going to refuse to pick up a shotgun (or ANY gun for that matter) if it says “Hecho En China” or anything else. I will use its unmistakeable racking sound to persuade the said offender that a closed casket isn’t the best option for him to pursue in his immediate future.
That said, go ahead and buy an H&R Pardner Protector and thank the good Lord that you live in a country that allows you to do so. AND QUIT YER BITCHIN!
As a followup, whatever you buy TAKE CARE OF IT and you won’t be disappointed as a proud and law-abiding gun owner.
Just bought one of these over an 870 that was double the price (my paycheck is not that big) and I have to say that I am impressed. She is definitely a solid, no frills, no bells and whistles shotgun. When I first got her the bolt stuck a little bit, but after racking her a few times (my ears are ringing), she smoothed out. I can’t wait for my next day off so I can take her out to exercise. Thanks to this, I now know what to expect with the recoil. Overall, a great review for a great gun.
A gun review that is both full of useful information and written with wit and style. Well done, sir.
The H&R Pardner Pump will also accept Magpul Remington 870 forend and butt stock, Here is my video for the Magpul Forend Grip.
I have someone wanting to sell me one for 300.00 i talked him down to 175.00 plus a laptop pc, am i getting ripped off? this is my first gun.
Factory new 179.00 at Walmart. I’d say guy is trying to take you for a ride. Even with aftermarket stock replacement, 175 and a laptop seem a bit much.
I got my H&R pardner last year, i love it. I shoot trap and clays with it and at 75 yards its pretty good.
Pingback: Pardner Pump Protector - 12ga - WaltherForums
Great review! Even fun to go back and reread. I noticed one of these at my local hardware store and after thinking it over for a day and reading your story here I went back and picked it up. My son and I had a blast taking the PPP to the range for a little shakedown. Sure I like U.S. made guns but I also appreciate a good value when I see it.
Pics on my blog
added a Pachmayr decelerator slip-on recoil pad to my P3 that along with Federal p.p.d.2.75 reduced recoil 00 buck make it a dream to shoot. Am thinking of adding a red dot sight. Anyone know of a good sight/base combination
In answer to my own question have added a UAG CQB red dot open reflex sight on a weaver top mount base made specificity for the pardner pump.Both on amazon w/shipping under 60 bucks looks and works great.Just remember to loctite the screws when installing the base.
So I just bought the H&R 1871 Pardner Pump. I can only fit 2 rounds in the mag and one chambered. Is this a problem or designed like this. Oh and the manual. I got 2 front halves of the manual.
nevermind. i read other comments and see that’s it’s already been asked. thanks!
I find the part I think is called the action bar lock problematic. (You can see the part I’m talking about in the above photo showing the manufacturer’s stamp & the trigger guard assembly.) That piece hanging down from the front of the guard has teeth. If you only have to fire this shotgun twice, no big deal, but over time that piece will hurt your finger. Is there any way to get a plastic cap to go over it? Seems as if you could make your own low tech fix for this problem, but I wonder if there is a manufactured, buyable fix.
I can’t imagine how you are holding your shotgun to have that part hurt your finger while firing it. Have someone show you the correct way to fire a pump shotgun.
I just bought the shot gun and had never actually fired it until today. Turns out the part (the slide lock release lever) that I thought would be a problem, is not. I could use the shotgun all day without using that lever. It only comes into play if the shotgun is empty and the action is closed. If the action is left open when empty, the lever never has to be touched.
This is the first time I’ve ever read a review that seems to be written by an unemployed food critic. “It’s great for what it was designed to do, but whine, whine, whine, huge exaggeration, whine.” Before your uncle got you this job, what did you do?
Pingback: H&R 1871 Pardner Pump Protector 12 Gauge | Temerity Magazine
Does anyone know if I can shoot steel shot through the Pardner Protector Pump? Or will it damage the bore?
I was looking up info on this pump shotgun,i would have been happier if it was made in the usa.H&R,made in China,sad.
I actually like, bring about I came across just what exactly I used to be having a look pertaining to. You’ve was over this Several day lengthy search for! The almighty Many thanks dude. Possess a pleasant time. Ok bye
I bought this gun in a lot. It was brand new to my neighbor last year but he needed cash. After reading reviews I believe I have a good defense weapon for myself and family. I am banking on the enormous pump action noise to do it’s job rather than a shell and a combination of blood, ruined walls, floors and potential legal action. My question is, until I further investigate more, is wondering if it is able to accept a Sure-Fire light on the rail? I may take it to Scheels too.
I bought one several years back because I was looking for a cheap shotgun for home defense. It turned out to be a great buy. I have sent about 500 rounds down the barrel at the range and it’s performed flawlessly.
Since we are living in the Obama peoples republic of amerika, I am not so sure that chicom products aren’t superior. I do know my P3 shoots great and with a new coat of paint it is better able to resist rust.